New Battlestar Galactica Or Old Battlestar Galactica

[UnderdogDJLSW]

I seem to remember these same types of debates happening between fans of the 1963 version of Flipper and the 1996 version with Jessica Alba

I think we all got spoiled with how well Star Trek brought back all of the original actors for the Movies beginning in 1979 that all fan bases expect the same for their favorite shows. I was a die-hard original BSG fan, counting down the hours every Sunday in 1978 until the show came on. When I saw the new show, I felt I didn't like the tact they were taking with it, but I was still able to watch it. The new version is just not must see for me. (We also don't have cable at home, so it's sometimes hard to). I would have loved for the show to continue with the actors I liked 30 years ago, but that would have had to have happened in the 90's at the latest. Personally, I am secretly glad that the one season that I loved as a kid hasn't been touched or continued. I'd rather keep those fond memories as that. Its like the new action figures of Superman today compared to the 8" Mego versions. They are neat but if they looked more like the 8" figures but let's say the knees didn't bend and the clothes were rubber and not cloth, then I would be more frustrated seeing that then the all plastic Justice League figure my daughter has. Does that make sense?

[grayhank]

John,

I think if you had watched the series beyond the first season you might have gotten a different perception of the "human cylons" rather than comparing them to the Terminator killer machine. Unlike the Terminator, they are self-aware and can be reasoned with and they are easily killed. Some have been shown to be quite passionate in trying to work with humans instead of destroying them (especially in the 3rd season). This has been more evident in the female cylons (Caprica 6, Boomer and the one played by Lucy Lawless). Unlike the Borg, they all have different personalities and they argue amongst themselves if they can't agree on something. The Borg are all of one mind and if one of them is destroyed their parts are harvested to make a new Borg. If a cylon is destroyed they are downloaded into a new body (a clone so to speak), retaining all the memories of the former body. So yes there are similarities between those other sci-fi characters but they are also unique to the show.

But if they are truly going to be compared to another scifi example then it has to be the "Replicants" in Blade Runner. I can agree with you there, but not with the Borg or Terminator.

[ctc]

>It's about survival period. There shouldn't be episodes about meeting 3-eyed aliens.

Why not? One of the things about setting the show in space is that you CAN have 'em meet different aliens. Might muddy the waters on the new show since space is apparently largely devoid of life. One of the problems of having a show devoid of aliens is that you take away a lot of the reasons for setting the show in space. But either way is valid. It does bug me that the whole "3 eyed alien" thing is presented as a cliche bugaboo to be avoided; considering how many cliches BOTH shows have embraced.

>And speaking as an adult, perhaps sometimes we want something a little more adult oriented on TV that doesn't cross the line into "adult entertainment".

A personal peeve of mine too; but I don't think the new Galactica really counts as grownup entertainment. Heavy handed symbolism, recycled plots and point and giggle sexuality does not an adult story make. You could tone down most of the questionable material and not really change anything. (Depending on how questionable you consider pregnancy.)

>If you were on a military vessel (say a submarine out at sea) and the entire US continent was wiped out unexpectently...wouldn't you perhaps be a little angry?

You'd be a LOT of things; angry, sad, frustrated, scared..... What bugs me is that for the last 15 years or so "angry" is the only facet writers seem to key in on. There'd also be a tendency to be SUPPORTIVE of each other, and not constantly squabble and bicker. Which is an interaction that writers seem to neglect too. (Not that this is limited to the new Galactica; it's omnipresent in all entertainment... but it's not helping the new Galactica.)

>Also, the use of human looking cyborgs/robots has been around a lot longer than the Terminator.

....but since Terminator it seems like ALL robots are androids. Hell; why bother with a humanoid form at all, other than to save on the cost of costumes?

>if they are truly going to be compared to another scifi example then it has to be the "Replicants" in Blade Runner.

.... or the androids from "Space: Beneath and Behind." Which was one of the reasons the new Galactica reminded me so much of that show. (All they're missing is Gammilon Deets.... or whatever he was called.)

>The X-Files in not completely original but it's not a rip-off.

Oh man; don't get me started on THIS one!

Don C.

[palitoy]

There are many rip-off's in sci-fi and there are many homages but it's insulting to marry popular concepts from other shows to make a new Galactica series

then it's exactly like the original series, except that borrowed more from a certain movie. Not a homage either.

Arguing a preference is pointless, you hate Ronald Moore and the new show, I still like it, now what? Neither of us is going to be proven right.

[jds1911a1]

The original series only lasted one season. The "second" season was Galactica 1980 which left much to be desired. Maybe if the original had not revamped so quickly it may have lasted longer. Starbuck and Apollo had basically been written out of the show by Galactica 1980. Kent McCord playing the role of a grown up Boxey (Apollo's son) was used instead. So I don't get where fans would be fighting to keep that one on.

The new Galactica plays tribute to all those fans of the original show who wanted the show to continue. They obviously couldn't go back and do the original series (Lorne Green had died many years ago). But they did bring back Apollo and Starbuck as well as kept many of the characters from the original (Adama, Apollo, Starbuck, Boomer/Athena, Commander Tighe, Baltar even Boxey was there for an episode).

I am grateful for the new one because I was a huge fan of the original. At first I could not accept the idea of a female Starbuck either. But after watching this series I find the character to be more intriging because of it. She has a lot of the same characteristics as Dirk Benedicts version, but she breathes more life into the role. It is also nice to see that the original Apollo (Richard Hatch) has a recurring role on the new one. The character he plays is almost likeable to a point but you're not sure you trust him.

For me comparing the old vs new is like comparing Adam West to Michael Keaton as Batman. Both have their good and bad qualities.

Actually the major reason for Galactica 1980 recast roles was the 2 year haitus between filming of Galactica and the start of filming for 1980. most of the cast became "flavor of the month" after BSG was a hit and signed on to other projects. by the time they were ready to start 1980 they had to redo the whole thing. Legend has it the show was originally planned as a series of tv movies but the pilot was such a hit they chagned to a weekly series. I remember it keep changing timeslots (Much like CBS did with the FLASH in the 90's) I never found out if that was becuase BSG was a bomb in a slot or it did so well they moved it to tougher slots to hopefully steal veiwers.
the major reason for the plots of 1980 was MONEY. Even with the recycling of footage BSG did in season 1 their production budget was through the roof (and they ran out of cylon suits to blow up about 3/4 though shooting). and the technology of the time made the viper shots really tough to shoot. So with the reduced budget it was Cheaper to use "modern" earth so they had less money tied up in set dressing and costumeing (same reason that Wonder Woman shifted from ww2 to osi based tales). They aslo cut down on the guest star quotient. the 1st season had HUGE names the second were there ANY (exlcuding Wolf Man jack). By the Time Larson realized his mistake 1980 was already on the chopping block and "return of Starbuck" was the last episode (and in my opinion the best)

[grayhank]

>It's about survival period. There shouldn't be episodes about meeting 3-eyed aliens.

Why not? One of the things about setting the show in space is that you CAN have 'em meet different aliens. Might muddy the waters on the new show since space is apparently largely devoid of life. One of the problems of having a show devoid of aliens is that you take away a lot of the reasons for setting the show in space. But either way is valid. It does bug me that the whole "3 eyed alien" thing is presented as a cliche bugaboo to be avoided; considering how many cliches BOTH shows have embraced.

Because then it really turns into a cliche of "Star Trek" or "Star Wars" and characters like that have been way over-used. (Stargate, Lost in Space, Babylon 5, Space 1999, Dr. Who, Buck Rogers, Flash Gordon, etc.) You've also got to remember that the original BSG was an attempt to cash in on the Star Wars fanbase.

>You'd be a LOT of things; angry, sad, frustrated, scared..... What bugs me is that for the last 15 years or so "angry" is the only facet writers seem to key in on. There'd also be a tendency to be SUPPORTIVE of each other, and not constantly squabble and bicker. Which is an interaction that writers seem to neglect too. (Not that this is limited to the new Galactica; it's omnipresent in all entertainment... but it's not helping the new Galactica.)

The characters are very supportive of each other on BSG, although it's not always quite so obvious. People will always be at conflict with other people, just look at how many opinions, debates and arguments appear on places like the Mego Boards for example. I think we all support each other here and most of us came here because we had a common interest...but how often do we see eye to eye? We get worked up just discussing tv shows. It's a good thing that Politics and Religion are taboo topics because then we'd truly be at each others throats.

I think that most people who are opposing the current BSG dropped the show before they gave it a chance. Granted it did drag quite a bit in the beginning, but if you made it to the very end of Season 2 where the "one year later" prologue begins and goes right into season 3 you might see it differently. The first 4 episode story arc of Season 3 alone shows some wonderful examples of just how dynamic the show is. If those episodes don't spark you or move you emotionally then I don't think there's a show out there you could find watchable. Perhaps that's the reason why shows like "Dancing with the Stars" are so popular.

[palitoy]

Because then it really turns into a cliche of "Star Trek" or "Star Wars" and characters like that have been way over-used. (Stargate, Lost in Space, Babylon 5, Space 1999, Dr. Who, Buck Rogers, Flash Gordon, etc.)

It seemed when the original series was filmed you couldn't have a show without aliens in space, it was expected of you just like blasters and dog fights were now part of nomenclature.

Alot of terrific series have decided that space is devoid of alien life such as Firefly and Red Dwarf. I don't think the decision not to have aliens makes a show any less interesting.

[Airdave817]

Sorry, but I haven't really given the new Battlestar Galactica a try. I'm sure it's quite good on it's own and compared to the original it's probably much better. I've seen some episodes here and there of Stargate and Stargate: Atlantis. I liked both Star Trek and Next Generation. I was a huge fan of the original Galactica. Had the pocket book, collected the comics, watched the show. There's just something cheesy-cool about Lorne Greene as Adama. I just can't see the Cylons as cyborgs or as hot chicks. Maybe they could have re-imagined Boomer or one fo the other characters as a hot chick. Maybe Starbuck and his sister? Instead of Apollo and Zak?

Give me the cheesy-cool original. I'm old-fashioned.

(I did see Letterman's Galactica Top ten last night and thought it was pretty cool.)

[palitoy]

Give me the cheesy-cool original. I'm old-fashioned.

The original is a great show and normally I'm strictly for the old fashion on everything. I think remade BSG is the first modern sci fi series I've liked in ten years. I have no interest in buying boxed sets like I did with the original show but I watch when it's on.

[megoscott]

I used to want to be Starbuck, now I want to, ahem, be with Starbuck. This is progress.

[Werewolf]

I don't think the decision not to have aliens makes a show any less interesting.

I personally think the lack of aliens in some series has more to do with budget than anything. Not counting something like Red Dwarf where it was the running gag of the show.

Story line wise I personally find the lack of aliens in the reimagined BSG to be a mix of egotism, budget and overall blandness of vision. Same with the human Cylons. Cheaper and easier to have human Cylons than make an army of believable Cylon robot costumes.

[megoscott]

I personally think the lack of aliens in some series has more to do with budget than anything. Not counting something like Red Dwarf where it was the running gag of the show.

Story line wise I personally find the lack of aliens in the reimagined BSG to be a mix of egotism, budget and overall blandness of vision. Same with the human Cylons. Cheaper and easier to have human Cylons than make an army of believable Cylon robot costumes.

Totally disagree. While a lot of the decisions they make are due to budget considerations (some episodes are more talky and more set-based so they can save the FX budget for other action oriented episodes) the whole "who's a cylon" thread has been a source of rich drama and intrigue right up to last season's brilliant finale.

[palitoy]

I personally think the lack of aliens in some series has more to do with budget than anything. Not counting something like Red Dwarf where it was the running gag of the show.

I don't know if I agree, the aliens could just look like us. Firefly seemed to have a decent budget yet they chose not include other races, I think it's a storytelling choice personally.

Story line wise I personally find the lack of aliens in the reimagined BSG to be a mix of egotism, budget and overall blandness of vision.

Well it's hard to debate things like egotism but I personally find it bolder to not take the alien root these days. Ronald Moore came from TNG where it was a new bird nosed race every week, I hated that. He could have easily phoned that in again but I'm glad he didn't. So I'm not sure I think it's a blandness of vision, few shows have tried to do this.

Same with the human Cylons. Cheaper and easier to have human Cylons than make an army of believable Cylon robot costumes

Well, the human cyclons are to add a new dimension to the villains, kind of "Invasion of the Body Snatchers" thing instead of just "Humans VS Bad Monotone Robots" thing. Galactica 80 had a humanoid Cyclon too.

They do have armies of CG Cyclons to do their dirty work which are probably more expensive than decent guys in suits, which I would honestly prefer. When the classic cyclons appeared on Razor, I was really ticked they were CGI.

[johnmiic]

John,
I think if you had watched the series beyond the first season you might have gotten a different perception of the "human cylons" rather than comparing them to the Terminator killer machine. Unlike the Terminator, they are self-aware and can be reasoned with and they are easily killed. Some have been shown to be quite passionate in trying to work with humans instead of destroying them (especially in the 3rd season). This has been more evident in the female cylons (Caprica 6, Boomer and the one played by Lucy Lawless).

I didn’t have cable so I only got to see the first season in it’s entirety by buying the boxed set. I bought it because no one I know here in NY would record it for me. What I had heard of the 1st season did make me want to see how good it was. I was impressed with many stories. I do realize you have to actually watch something to form an opinion and know something of what you’re talking about. I'm trying to borrow thre other seasons from friends but if they go cheap enough I may buy season 2. I want to see the Pegasus story arc. I like Michelle Forbes.

Unlike the Borg, they all have different personalities and they argue amongst themselves if they can't agree on something. The Borg are all of one mind and if one of them is destroyed their parts are harvested to make a new Borg. If a cylon is destroyed they are downloaded into a new body (a clone so to speak), retaining all the memories of the former body. So yes there are similarities between those other sci-fi characters but they are also unique to the show.

But if they are truly going to be compared to another scifi example then it has to be the "Replicants" in Blade Runner. I can agree with you there, but not with the Borg or Terminator.

I can see the comparison to Replicants but the Replicants were not a race and were not determined to exterminate humanity. They resembled us and wanted to reach their full potential. I can see the comparison tho how people created replicants and they rebelled because gave them shorter life spans fearing they would overtake us, etc.

In regards to the Borg-while these Cylons have personalities and individuality, and they don't sport tubes, wires or rubber suits on the outside they are renewable. You can kill 1 but they will keep on coming. Really they are immortal. If I was immortal I don’t know that I would pro-actively set out to exterminate humanity. I mean I could just sit and wait them out or start exploring the galaxy in the other direction.

then it's exactly like the original series, except that borrowed more from a certain movie. Not a homage either.

Arguing a preference is pointless, you hate Ronald Moore and the new show, I still like it, now what? Neither of us is going to be proven right.

Yes, Brian, I hate Ron Moore, LOL! But also let me say don’t think I am on a soap box yelling at you guys like some Sci-Fi Gestapo. I know you guys like the show and I am not trying to win an argument at all costs. These are things that have been on my mind. I am saying that if he was a "fan" to re-imagine the show why shoe-horn in elements that don't compliment the concept. The Cylons look like us-paranoia theme may have provided some good intrigue but even in the first season I think it wore thin and started to get ridiculous. I think it's also the cheap way out. Take a look at the War of the Worlds TV series. We can't afford to do Martians as BEM's so lets say they posess peoples bodies and we can just use stock costumes and pale up peoples faces a little, ugh!

>
>The X-Files in not completely original but it's not a rip-off.

Oh man; don't get me started on THIS one!

Don C.

Hmmm, a can of worms for another day….

[grayhank]

In case you didn't see it in the other BSG thread, here is a somewhat comical recap of the show from the beginning to the end of Season 3. But just in case: SPOILER WARNING!

What the Frak is Going On? | Catch Up to Season Four | Battlestar Galactica | SCIFI.COM