Scalper/Dealer Difference?

[ODBJBG]

I agree with a lot of what has been said here. A lot of people think they're a "dealer" because they went and bought up all the product at their local Walmart, but they're not. They're a scalper.

Real dealers don't buy up everything. They buy enough that they think they're able to make a profit (etc), whereas a scalper will ALWAYS pick up the latest hot new figure he sees on the shelf, even if he has 100,000 at home.

The other difference is usually in pricing. It's one thing to mark a product up to make a profit. It's another to buy a $20 He-man figure and then put him on Ebay for $75 before you even have him in hand yet from Mattel.

[Brazoo]

Scalping only applies to items available from a retail venue, purchased to resell on a secondary market (while the item is available) resold. And the fact that many scalpers can still return said product to the purchasing store for a full refund within 90 days means they have no risk only reward

THANK YOU - this is exactly what I was trying to say!

Though using the term "secondary market" may be confusing because I hear people using that to describe the post-retail/collectors market - I would just say it creates a black market.

[jds1911a1]

I have a friend who does a similar thing with real estate. Is he a scalper?

He uses the money as income as well as finances his home(s).

Different market different terms - your friend is a speculator. I also suspect he takes that property and makes impovements to make it attractive to a buyer. I suspect there are also properties he has to sell for a loss because the market didn't materialize (ie failed urban renewal). Say your friend buys a parcel of land because it's near the local "hip place" to live in hopes the hipsters expand to this zone soon. but rather than a hipster pad the city makes it the site of a new prison. suddenly his investment is unsellable. that is the risk in speculating. Similarly a toy dealer who was wise enough to buy star wars figs at 1.98 in 1977 and hoard them till later and sell for 300 he speculated and won. that same dealer may have forked over 5.99 for a POTF2 luke in 1995 that no one wants and has to donate it to a charity or throw out because the cost of storage is prohibitvie for the potential return.

Scalping only applies to items available from a retail venue, purchased to resell on a secondary market (while the item is available) resold. And the fact that many scalpers can still return said product to the purchasing store for a full refund within 90 days means they have no risk only reward

[TrueDave]

I got into this during a bleak time. 1980s so EVERYTHING I got was old ( worth having) I can wait.

Back before I got internet ( 5 years ) It was teh flea Market guys that got me.

Marvel Legends Red Skull? etc?

Thats why I like collecting reproductions. Whatever I;'m hooked on was originally made 30 years ago.

I can wait. And enjoy what I already have :-)

Sure there are some things that disappear. I would like to habve a Retro Mattel Supes and Luthor. and maybe Sinestro.

But I''l wait for those Rhino and Invisible Girl hoarders out there.

Still hope they improve the body and skin color problem. Even Silver Age DC has too light a skin.

[GreenLantern9999]

Just to toss this out there I am a comic book store owner and I do not buy anything from other stores to stock my own shelves but one might see my prices and call is scalping but truth be told if I order the same product from my distributors it costs almost the same if I bought it from Walmart so I have a higher price and people look at me like I am stealing from them.

[Brazoo]

>I personally think collectors are mostly to blame because they see collectibles as investments.

I agree. It kinda creates it's own separate market too; since it creates a percieved difference between "collectible" and "neat thing that sits on my computer." Then it becomes self-perpetuating.

>the whole idea of people using collectables as investments is deeply deeply flawed to me

....'cos it doesn't work. Any serious price jump is gonna be temporary, and you're very seldom gonna find an object that holds it's value for a decent enough price to make it proffitable. But it's like the lottery: just enough people win to make it seem worthwhile to the majority who don't.

Don C.

Yeah - well I don't care about people who can afford to gamble. Gambling comes out of their entertainment budget, that's fine. It's the people who think of gambling as an investment strategy - they're the ones in trouble. And the thing is people with gambling problems tend to remember the wins - not the losses.

I've seen friends spend/waste TONS of money off this stuff for short term gains - they just don't see the long term losses. I have done it too - but I stopped a long long time ago.

[Brazoo]

It's the exact same with ticket scalping - it's a racket, but it only exists because people tolerate it. If everyone agreed not to buy from scalpers then scalpers would disappear.

[Blue Meanie]

I respectfully disagree that scalpers are providing a service. They're taking products out of the market and holding them, creating a new market that wouldn't exist otherwise. Scalping is a racket - it artificially drives prices up and creates a black market.

I personally think collectors are mostly to blame because they see collectibles as investments. They actually get excited when they see prices jump because they feel the 'investments' they made have gone up in value as well. They remember the small percentage of collectables in their collections that actually increase in value short-term, or the even smaller percentage of collectables that continue to increase in value beyond the normal rate of inflation - but generally collectors choose to forget that the majority of all collectibles are decreasing in value.

I'm a little bit confused...on one hand you say that scalping is a racket...and then you say that the collectors are mostly to blame. In my opinion "one hand washes the other" in this case. I can tell you from experience of having done plenty of toy/comic shows in the past...I used to when I would see the latest "collector" that came along in the Star Wars game back when they re-released new figures in '95. The Star Wars fan was the absolute WORST when it came to "I gotta have it now". They created their own mess...not the scalpers. All of those idiotic so called "variants" that were basically paint errors in the factory. I once told a Star Wars collector that came into a friends store that they should wait a couple of weeks for a Yoda figure that just came out...I told them Hasbro usually short packs figures in the 1st wave of figures and the Yoda figure would start showing up in droves in a couple of weeks. He said I have to have that Yoda figure...My friend had it marked $15. The guy bought the figure. I gave him advice on how to wait for a figure that he knew was going to be out by the dozens in a couple of weeks yet he STILL bought the figure. And the guy wasn't a dealer....he was a regular collector that came in all the time. I just don't get that logic..."Let me pay 3 times for a figure so I can say I have it NOW." In the case of the Neo Star Wars collector it definitely is "one hand washes the other."

[samurainoir]

If your only intention is to take the rare/chase figs off the shelf to sell them at an inflated price on ebay while the demand is up you are a scalper. Whether you use the money as income or to finance collecting it's still scalping

I have a friend who does a similar thing with real estate. Is he a scalper?

He uses the money as income as well as finances his home(s).

[Blue Meanie]

If your only intention is to take the rare/chase figs off the shelf to sell them at an inflated price on ebay while the demand is up you are a scalper. Whether you use the money as income or to finance collecting it's still scalping

I completely agree. That sums it up in a nutshell.

[4NDR01D]

You want to REALLY get confused? What do you call someone who sells a carded action figure for $300 when it originally cost $1.98?

A very good businessman!

[4NDR01D]

I dont know if I agree with you on this. Think about it, by this definition, unless the employee who orders the inventory at TRU has a love of toys or a personal collection, then TRU would be one of the largest toy scalpers out there. They buy huge amounts of toys, mark them up 100%(customary for retail) then resell them at this inflated price.
Scalping is the "term" given to someone who resells something at a price the "term giver" feels is unfair. Like I said before, A SCALPER IS A DEALER THAT HAS PI$$ED SOMEONE OFF

I consider employees and stores that sell new products retailers, which is different from both dealers and scalpers, although they may show characteristics of both.
Oh geez, now I'm so confused i don't know what i believe anymore.

[4NDR01D]

Just my take, personally I think of somebody who has at least some interest in the product a dealer. Like somebody who scrounges around at flea-markets for records say, finds some rare ones, and flips them for a profit. A dealer typically deals in used product.


A scalper has no interest in the product. A scalper may buy mass quantities of a product that's in short supply but high demand like concert or sporting event tickets, they don't have to like the band/team, know who plays for them, or give a crap about them, just know that the concert/game is going to sell out and that some people who didnt get tickets at regular prices would be willing to spend more than the going rate for the tickets.

you can't really be a dealer of concert tickets, but you can scalp.
you can't scalp old furnature, but you can deal.

[ctc]

>I personally think collectors are mostly to blame because they see collectibles as investments.

I agree. It kinda creates it's own separate market too; since it creates a percieved difference between "collectible" and "neat thing that sits on my computer." Then it becomes self-perpetuating.

>the whole idea of people using collectables as investments is deeply deeply flawed to me

....'cos it doesn't work. Any serious price jump is gonna be temporary, and you're very seldom gonna find an object that holds it's value for a decent enough price to make it proffitable. But it's like the lottery: just enough people win to make it seem worthwhile to the majority who don't.

Don C.

[Brazoo]

I respectfully disagree that scalpers are providing a service. They're taking products out of the market and holding them, creating a new market that wouldn't exist otherwise. Scalping is a racket - it artificially drives prices up and creates a black market.

I personally think collectors are mostly to blame because they see collectibles as investments. They actually get excited when they see prices jump because they feel the 'investments' they made have gone up in value as well. They remember the small percentage of collectables in their collections that actually increase in value short-term, or the even smaller percentage of collectables that continue to increase in value beyond the normal rate of inflation - but generally collectors choose to forget that the majority of all collectibles are decreasing in value.

Anyway - by and large that is why I think scalpers are even tolerated by collectors. They add excitement to the game the way that decreasing your odds adds excitement to gambling because it increases the amount you can win - or something like that.

No disrespect intended, but of course scalpers are not trading in "necessities", if they were they'd be in jail because we have laws against this kind of thing.

The dealer market - or secondary/collectors market exists for collectables that are no longer available. There is no other market for these items. There are no set market prices either - collectables are worth whatever anyone is willing to pay. Making a profit (even an exorbitant one) is not scalping to me as I understand it at all. I don't think there's a moral obligation to regulate the prices of these collectables at all - unless a dealer cares about being competitive or gaining repeat business. Though I guess most of you guys are just using the word "scalper" as an insult for people who are asking too much?

In any case, this is probably a very strange place to say this - but the whole idea of people using collectables as investments is deeply deeply flawed to me.