Man of Steel review - WITH SPOILERS

[Wise4671]

There are a lot of reasons I did not like the move. Hate the suit. Lois knowing his identity, the tornado scene, no jimmy Olsen I can keep going. And you know what your right about this day and age I'm not making racist remarks I'm calling out these films for being racist against white people if anything. So please jump down off the pedestal because if you can't see the racism in changing a character that has been white since the story was written then you are very one sided.

[Hector]

Yeah, you are right, that evil Larry Fishburne took Jim Carrey's spot, how dare he...Black millionaire is taking food away from White millionaire, how terribly racist, you have finally enlightened me, thank you so much.

[thunderbolt]

Man, what a ******. John Landis should be ashamed for creating such a monstrosity.

[Earth 2 Chris]

As the person who started this thread, I ask that we please not turn this into the whole "they cast a black actor as a white character" thread again. It's old, tired, and has been explored here numerous times.

Chris

[hedrap]

FWIW, they cast Fishburne for the same reason they made Lois a redhead, changed how the Kents find the ship, etc...

In 2010/2011, WB wasn't sure how the court was going to rule in the copyright case with the Siegel estate. If they lost, it split ownership in half, based on what Siegel created. They had a deadline date of 2013 for last full profits, if they lost. So Goyer created a blueprint on how to differentiate the two and all the changes spring outward.

That's why the title is "Man Of Steel" and not "Superman: Man Of Steel". It's why we get the little name-joke in the first commercials, so on and so forth.

I wasn't until one of the recent interviews Snyder or Goyer admitted Lee changed Supes design to match the MOS movie design, which is what, (changing Supes), Dido and Lee has said officially got the ball rolling on revamping the entire DCU. So DC52 did happen because of MOS. No one has been willing to go on record yet, but it slipped.

MOS was a way to minimize whatever profits the Siegel's would have gotten if they won. It would have forced the Siegel's into selling their piece to DC or license it to Marvel. My guess is, this is what Marvel was partly anticipating when they bought Marvelman/Miracleman; take the character and merge it with the Siegel's piece of Superman and it would have been a way to circumvent the other Marvel/Miracle ownership issues. But since the Siegel's lost, DC can go back to business as usual, and Marvel has to slog through Marvel/Miracle ownership before they can reboot him into Marvel continuity.

[Earth 2 Chris]

^I don't know. Perry White wasn't even the editor in the early Superman comics. I'm not sure the name didn't originate on the radio show, which DC controlled through Bob Maxwell. Jimmy Olsen definitely debuted on the radio show, and he was the most radically changed character, so I'm not sure ALL the changes were in anticipation of fallout from the Siegel lawsuit.

Chris

[madmarva]

So DC52 did happen because of MOS. No one has been willing to go on record yet, but it slipped.

Yeah, the lawsuit prompted both the changes made for the movie and the New 52. Certainly they weren't showing all their cards, but when Didio and Lee were made co-publishers and Johns made chief Creative officer all answering to Nelson, the trio made statements to the affect that Warner wanted the most recognizable versions of the characters and that film and comics would be more streamlined. I think they were directly answering a question about the Flash being Barry Allen rather than Wally West, but it blankets the changes made to Superman with the films becoming the dogs rather than the tails. That answer was given during the fall of 2010 when plans for the New 52 were just coming together and probably before any publicity on Man of Steel began.

Of course with Robinov being maneuvered out at Warners, who knows what's going on with DC right now. Johns said back in late April or May ( and I think Robinov was quoted in NYTimes too) about announcements forthcoming, likely at ComicCon, about the future of DC films. I hope they go full steam ahead. Supposedly Robinov and the head of Legendary, the co-producer of the recent DC films, had issues.

Some are guessing Levitz might be back in play in management at DC, according to Bleeding Cool. That would be a good thing for the comics and the talent, but is probably wishful thinking.

[Earth 2 Chris]

Some are guessing Levitz might be back in play in management at DC, according to Bleeding Cool. That would be a good thing for the comics and the talent, but is probably wishful thinking.

I'm not sure that would help much. Levitz's later years were mired with a lot of wishy-washy initiatives. He pretty much sat back and let DiDio have the run of the place.

What's Jenette Kahn doing nowadays?

[boynightwing]

I just saw this awesome video on youtube from the writer of Chronicle. He has an interesting view on Man of Steel and current superhero movies in general. His opinion on the film pretty much mirrors my own. Don't watch this at work or around your kids as it has bad words in it. I think he's a little rough on Peter Parker when talks about Spider-man but otherwise I agree with him on everything else. I like character driven stories over action/plot driven stories. It's why I liked Donner's Superman way better. Heck, I like Superman Returns better for the same reason and that movie was all kinds of screwed up.

Let's put the Hero back in Superhero is his point and I agree %100.

“Dark and tortured” and “Superman” never belong in the same sentence, unless that sentence is “Superman met his dark and tortured friend Batman for coffee.”

[boynightwing]

The logic behind the Codex and The Fortress does fall apart until you consider the larger implications for the human race.

Kryptonians knew about Earth, and at some point, a Kryptonian from the Fortress walked among early man, right when the last glacial period ended.

This means anyone from Adam and Eve forward, could be Kryptonian. Either way, it implies people have Kryptonian DNA buried somewhere inside.

Include the codex as a genetic key to unlock the matrix, and whammo, whoever has the code possesses the ability to be metahuman.

This makes every classical myth god to Aquaman, Wonder Woman and Shazam, direct desecendents. While metahumans like Flash have latent Kryptonian DNA which can be activated under certain circumstances.

Add tech deriving from alien races, such as Luthor's battlesuit, and perhaps Brainiac and Metallo, and you got the pieces to rationally explain almost any character or anything to occur in the DCU.

You just blew my mind. Thank you. That is easily the best way to think about it.

[kingdom warrior]

There are a lot of reasons I did not like the move. Hate the suit. Lois knowing his identity, the tornado scene, no jimmy Olsen I can keep going. And you know what your right about this day and age I'm not making racist remarks I'm calling out these films for being racist against white people if anything. So please jump down off the pedestal because if you can't see the racism in changing a character that has been white since the story was written then you are very one sided.

WOW!!!! Racist films against white people...LMFAO!!!!!! I see you don't know film history do you?.....one character gets changed and that's what you think?
Larry Fishburne is an award winning actor, playwright, director, and producer. when i heard he was cast I thought it was awesome....and Hector was right he was not given much in this movie.
and Lois knowing his Identity???? LOL!!! Dude, Lois Lane is a top news reporter in the comics, actually her not knowing makes her a buffoon...I always thought she should have figured it out....makes her more believable as a hard nose reporter.

[B-Lister]

^
The problem I have with this and Nick Fury is why do they take and feel they have to change an established character? I wouldn't think it would be right to make a movie about the Falcon and make him a white guy. But ok I'll play along lets say DC feels in the next Batman movie that they need to make an established character black how do you think this would play out?

If they cast a white guy, it'd be a movie full of white guys.

Perry White is white in comics because he was created during a time when minorities were treated like crap.

The movie is racist against whites? Check your privilege. White lead, two sets of white parents, white villain, white love interest, white white white.

One character gets changed and it ruins the movie? Grow up.

I am not denying the movie had issues, but this isn't one of them.

[hedrap]

^I don't know. Perry White wasn't even the editor in the early Superman comics. I'm not sure the name didn't originate on the radio show, which DC controlled through Bob Maxwell. Jimmy Olsen definitely debuted on the radio show, and he was the most radically changed character, so I'm not sure ALL the changes were in anticipation of fallout from the Siegel lawsuit.

Chris

I didn't meant to imply they changed White because of Siegel implicitly. It's closer to what Marva said; it's a snowball effect.

When you look at Action #1 and see how little correlation it has to MOS, you can then see how every decision after that went through a Superman-MOS converter. The Siegel's were looking to expand ownership on several fronts.

Smallville's chance at becoming the film franchise was shot down because the Siegel's were barking about Superboy copyright, and if Welling put on the costume, then it retroactively admitted Smallville was Superboy:The Series. The Salkinds were also mired down in this craziness for sometime, and IIRC, that's where "Superboy Prime" and all that insanity sprang forth.

You're right about the radio show. Isn't that where Kryptonite also came from?

I feel bad for saying "The Siegel's", because it's not really Jerry's family, but one lawyer and some family who really don't have a dog in the hunt to begin with.

[Earth 2 Chris]

You're right about the radio show. Isn't that where Kryptonite also came from?

Yeah, although Siegel wrote a story about "K-Metal" that had the same weakening effect on Superman, but it was scrapped and never published because Lois would have learned Clark's secret in that story. The radio show introduced a LOT of the stuff we consider huge parts of the Superman mythos.

And I get you now on the "MOS conversion". The early days of this lawsuit caused Superboy to be called Superman in the LOSH toon as well.

Chris

[Wise4671]

I'm going to keep the rest of my replies to myself on this movie in respect of Chris. You guys are right this was the best film ever made and stays true to the character we have all grown up with.