Old Topic ... Does RTD hate the USA ?

[Mikey]

We talked about this quite a while ago, but I thought i'd like to hear insights from some of our newer members .......

Does RTD hate the USA ?

I can't think of one time in Doctor Who the New Series where the USA is represented as cool or even decent .......

We are always represented as overbearing a-wholes

It's like the New Series has a vendetta against the US ....

Opinions ?

[ctc]

>We are always represented as overbearing a-wholes

But if you think about it, other countries are usually portrayed as gits or terrorists in American films. It's egocentric. You know your own home best and have a tendency to play it up. Everyone else becomes a sort of parody/iconic/stereotyped representation 'cos you don't have the time or possibly capacity to get into their character. They end up shorthanded. And the usual shorthand for an American is boistrous, a bit indulgent and somewhat impatient. Often with a southern accent. (Which I suspect is the result of the same thinking that has all us Canadians talking like Newfoundlanders....)

It IS kinda funny to see a story where the aliens AREN'T always attacking the US or Japan. (I watch a lot of Japanese movies too.)

Don C.

[johnmiic]

So Mike, you didn't find the portrayal of Americans in Daleks Take Manhattan as complex and sympathetic? I mean no one s portrayed as cool but there are some really decent moral characters here as well as ugly and self-serving ones. The overbearing boss, the suffering working class, the papmered performers and the downtrodden homeless all different aspects of Depression Era Americans? I think the choice to set a DW story in the USA and in Depression Era NY was pretty ambitious of RTD.

[Bo8a_Fett]

LOL in a lot of American films the english accent always belongs to the baddies...I mean look at Star Wars...lol...some examples below:
Gone in Sixty Seconds
Tango and Cash
The Aristocats
Alan Rickman in Die Hard (a case of an English actor playing a Germanic character with a slight accent), Help! I'm a Fish, Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves and Quigley Down Under.
Anthony Hopkins in The Silence of the Lambs6.
Basil Rathbone in Anna Karenina, David Copperfield, Son of Frankenstein and The Mark of Zorro7
Ben Kingsley in Sneakers.
Betty Lou Gerson as the definitive villainess, Cruella DeVille in 101 Dalmations (see also American actress Glenn Close playing the same role for the live-action remake).
Charles Dance in Last Action Hero.
Christopher Lee in (among many others) Star Wars: Attack of the Clones and The Lord of the Rings Trilogy.
Claude Rains in Notorious8.
David Bowie in Labyrinth and The Last Temptation of Christ (in which all the non-Roman biblical characters are played by Americans).
Dougray Scott in Mission: Impossible 2.
George Sanders in Rebecca and Walt Disney's The Jungle Book.
James Mason in North by Northwest , Salem's Lot and The Verdict.
Jeremy Irons in Die Hard With a Vengeance (where again, it's an English actor playing a Germanic character), The Lion King and The Time Machine.
John Lithgow in Cliffhanger and Shrek (American actor hamming as British, though Lithgow has also played his fair share of homegrown villains, too).
Jonathan Hyde in Jumanji
Joss Ackland in Lethal Weapon 2 (British actor, South African accent!)
Pam Ferris in Matilda
Patrick Stewart in Conspiracy Theory
Peter Cushing in Star Wars9 (an example of the Imperialism mentioned above being used as short-hand to differentiate between the old order (Jedis and the Empire) and the new (the Rebellion Alliance).
Pierce Brosnan in Mrs Doubtfire10.
Ray Milland in Dial M for Murder.
Richard Attenborough in Jurassic Park (although his character in the film version was much more benign and unconsciously dangerous than in the books).
Sir Ian McKellen in X-Men11
Steven Berkoff in Beverly Hills Cop.
Tim Curry in The Rocky Horror Picture Show (alongside Richard O'Brien and Patricia Quinn, both sporting East-European accents).
Timothy Dalton in The Shadow.
Tom Wilkinson in Rush Hour.

[Bo8a_Fett]

I think RTD has got more against Fat people than Americans...he kills fatties off all over the place...
Clive in Rose was just the first...and that was the fist episode....I'd better go on a diet.

[Mikey]

I think RTD has got more against Fat people than Americans...he kills fatties off all over the place

If that's true, remind me NEVER to go near the Doctor Who studio

[Gorn Captain]

Hmm.
well, one problem is that the present US administration hasn't exactly made a lot of friends internationally. I love America, the country, my best friend is American, but certain Americans (let's say Mr X), I could do without. But that's politics, so I'll shut up about that before opening that particular can of worms.

But let's reverse it: why do Americans quite often use European to play bad guys? (see also previous posts). Is "being different" linked to "being bad"?

I think the whole world is becoming paranoid and wary of others. Not just internationally, but also within countries. Belgium is in the midst of actually breaking up in two parts (Flemish and Walloon). A pinprick of a country, and still we argue.
In recent polls, 25% of the German population has voiced racist views. 30% of the people of Antwerp voted for a racist party.

Need I say more?
The human race is breaking up in fractions. And SciFi is just mirroring that.

[ctc]

>Is "being different" linked to "being bad"?

Yup. But that's universal. (The Japanese language has the verb "chigau" which means "to be wrong/to be different.") People REALLY don't like stuff that's new to them. Never did. Never will.

>why do Americans quite often use European to play bad guys?

Most European accents sound hoity-toity and/or highbrow here. So a criminal mastermind might have a British accent 'cos it makes him sound smart. Accents also quicky denote someone as being different/an outisder and makes 'em easy to identify. Kinda what I was getting at in the first post: when you hear an accent a shorthanded image of that nationality will typically spring to mind.

Don C.

[Bo8a_Fett]

Hey ...but you Yanks like us Brits really....right?

[Gorn Captain]

Personally, I LOVE stuff that's different.
That's why I love SF and Fantasy.

Sometimes it's so odd: I know someone who's crazy about Star Trek and aliens, but he dislikes "non-whites". I just can't make that fit together.
Star Trek is all about tolerance and getting along.
The UNITED Federation of Planets.

But moving on to a more important comment in your post: So you think our accents make us sound smart?
Hmmm. What a wonderful compliment.
Now if only we WERE actually smarter....

>Is "being different" linked to "being bad"?

Yup. But that's universal. (The Japanese language has the verb "chigau" which means "to be wrong/to be different.") People REALLY don't like stuff that's new to them. Never did. Never will.

>why do Americans quite often use European to play bad guys?

Most European accents sound hoity-toity and/or highbrow here. So a criminal mastermind might have a British accent 'cos it makes him sound smart. Accents also quicky denote someone as being different/an outisder and makes 'em easy to identify. Kinda what I was getting at in the first post: when you hear an accent a shorthanded image of that nationality will typically spring to mind.

Don C.

[Mikey]

We love you guys !!!!!!!!!

We love yous so much, sometimes we get upset when yous don't love us back -- Like RTD

[Bo8a_Fett]

We love you guys !!!!!!!!!

We love yous so much, sometimes we get upset when yous don't love us back -- Like RTD

[The Bat]

Hey ...but you Yanks like us Brits really....right?

Hell Yeah! Most of Us in "New England"...are Your decendant's.

Grandfather-William Shaw(Scotch/Irish) & Grand Mother-Lillian Walker(English).

[Bo8a_Fett]

Damn that's a lot of christmas cards to buy

[Mikey]

Hell Yeah! Most of Us in "New England"...are Your decendant's.

Grandfather-William Shaw(Scotch/Irish) & Grand Mother-Lillian Walker(English).

That's not necessarily a good thing with Brits ....

Most Brits count their American decendants as traiters of the crown