The Ramones vs. The Sex Pistols

[Manspider]

Without a doubt... Ramones

[timmy]

Ramones vs Sex Pistols

I was lucky enough to be from North Jersey. I would see the Ramones a couple times a year from 1988-1995 in my highschool to college years. Something like 15 times total between City Gardens, CBGBs and Chestnut Cabaret. Would see Joey in the city and Johnny every year at the Comic & Horror shows in NYC. Johnny was always polite and would talk monster movies with us.

Because of that I think I took them for granted, I look back and and now really miss them.

I got to see Pistols reunion in 2003 in Atlantic City, they were very tight and more powerful than expected. Ran into the band at casino later that night as most punk fans had departed AC. They let me buy them drinks. It was a cool fulfillment of a childhood dream to see them live, but I didn't love them the way I loved the Ramones.

Listen to indie 103.1 online Steve Jones has a radio show and often talks about Pistols and Ramones. The station was very committed to the Ramones in their last days.

Indie 103.1 | Indie Home

[Cosmicman]

Ramones all the way! I am honored to say that my band got to open up for them at the Barrymore in 1995. It was a total honor meeting them backstage for a whole five minutes. Nice guys! Joey Ramone was so cool!

[Donkey Hoatie]

Hard to say

What does relevance mean?

Musically, it's the Ramones. Hands down. Ramones Mania is still one of my favorite albums of all time, and I've been listening to it for 20 years now. Listen to that thing and tell me it's not awesome. Sure, about 11 of the songs sound the same during the intro, but I'm OK with that. There's only so much you can do with 6 different chords.

Culturally though, I'd have to go with the Sex Pistols. I don't think you can deny the cultural perspective the Sex Pistols helped develop with the image of punk rock. If you asked casual music fans who they thought was the best punk band, I think you'd get more people saying Sex Pistols than Ramones. Mind you, I'm talking about CASUAL listeners.

[thunderbolt]

The Ramones, the pistols were just the punk version of the Monkees. I've met both Joey and Johnny Rotten, Joey was the nicest guy you could meet, and johnny was the wanker you expect him to be, almost like he's always in character, very fake and pretentious.

[huedell]

Exactly. For better or for worse, the Pistols pretty much defined the parameters
in which "punk" was understood.

If so---then for me---its "for worse" I'm not into 98% of what the SPs brought
to the table....again, I guess this thread is more about the world's opinion and history's
opinion than mine----I just happen to be diameterically opposed to the SPs
inspired punk trends---while I LOVE what the RAMONES brought to punk (FIRST by
the way)

neither were masterminds in songwriting

Depends how you definie "masterminds"----the RAMONES took traditional
50s/60s/early 70s pop and made it more dirty----more raw---- and more heavy
while retaining melodic hooks----a NEW kinda pop styled songwriting----and their
crafting of the hooks was much more consistentent than just about any other history
honored "punk" band----I think that's pretty masterful

THE RAMONES were ahead of their time-----THE SEX PISTOLS were a "sign of the times"

[Goblin19]

The Ramones, easily. Their music still sounds brand new today.

[megoat]

I'd have to agree. If I say to you "I saw this punk kid today..." what picture pops into your mind... a Ramone? Hell no! You picture a kid w/ dyed spikey hair, torn clothes, boots, studs, spikes, safety pins... a Pistol.
Never Mind the Bullocks is a nearly perfect record, but it represents far more than a musical time capsule. It is the gate through which most punks find the "lifestyle"

Exactly. For better or for worse, the Pistols pretty much defined the parameters in which "punk" was understood.

[misterdroid]

But that said, the one record really is something to hear, 'specially when heard in historical context. I mean, the Ramones may have started it, but the 'Pistols certainly helped DEFINE it....

I'd have to agree. If I say to you "I saw this punk kid today..." what picture pops into your mind... a Ramone? Hell no! You picture a kid w/ dyed spikey hair, torn clothes, boots, studs, spikes, safety pins... a Pistol.
Never Mind the Bullocks is a nearly perfect record, but it represents far more than a musical time capsule. It is the gate through which most punks find the "lifestyle"

[misterdroid]

The Ramones are just timeless. Sex Pistols were just an assembled punk boy band because The New York Dolls weren't available.

The New York Dolls were not an assembled boy band. If anything, the inspiration behind the ramones would be the Dolls. Sure the Dolls wore make-up and outfits but they were quite real. And yes the Dolls were managed by Malcolm Mclaren in the end, in the heat of Thunders and Nolan's addiction... when a dollar earned was a dollar for dope, and it broke the band... fast. The Dolls pre-date the Ramones by about 3 years. The Dolls, while lumped in to "punk" actually represent a return to punchy '50's/60's songwriting. The same can be said of the Ramones. That is in fact how the first Ramones record was marketed. The Ramones have more in common with the Ronnettes than they do with anything traditionally considered "classic" punk.

As far as the original question of this thread, who was more influential, Pistols or Ramones... I hear echoes of Steve Jones in stuff all the time, especially in a lot of the swedish brand of good rock 'n roll, hell I hear a lot of jones in some metal even (new Darkthrone). And I hear Lydon's snot and snarl in most politically minded punk, even if they think they are the new Clash, they are just aping decades old awesome (lookin' at you Anti-Flag). And I hear some Ramones in every flavor of the month pop-punk conglomerate that bursts from the suburbs and lands on Hot Topic shelves. And even more from american bands that are just having fun (Riverdales, ******, Dwarves etc.). I think in both cases much of the influence that I hear these days are second/third/fourth hand. A band influenced by a band that was influenced by a band influenced by the Ramones/ Pistols.

Tie.

[Bionic Joe]

Time to BEAT ON THE BRAT...... WITH A BASEBALL BAT....OH YEAH

[kingdom warrior]

Ramones! by a mile The music was great.

[draconianguard]

The Ramones are just timeless. Sex Pistols were just an assembled punk boy band because The New York Dolls weren't available.

[megoat]

What about Iggy?

Proto-punker!

The Sex Pistols were such a calculated move, almost of Spice Girls proportions. I mean, the only reason Sid was in the band was because of his look and attitude. They kicked out Glen Matlock who was instrumental in writing of the songs that ended up on NMTB. The whole thing was a sort of a, should i say it?--Swindle.

But that said, the one record really is something to hear, 'specially when heard in historical context. I mean, the Ramones may have started it, but the 'Pistols certainly helped DEFINE it....

[Bill]

The Ramones were a band, the Sex Pistols were something different, maybe a product or and advertisement, or both. Both were huge influences, neither were masterminds in songwriting.
I think about the Ramones when I think about the Ramones. The Sex Pistols make me think about more than just the band.Vivian Westwood, Malcolm McClaren, the first time I ever saw a mohawk on TV, "Sid Was Innocent" or "Sid Lives" written on high school notebooks and bleached into Converse shoes.

What about Iggy?