Doctor who in the 80's the JNT era

[jds1911a1]

I have been watching Dr who every story in broadcast order for months (ever since I completed the run including all the reconstructed lost stories) and I am finally in the 79-80 season (the start of the jon Nathan-Turner era). It's ironic, at the time he changed the theme and the incidental music it was because it felt dated to him, well I just finished the leisure hive and Meglos and boy does it feel dated.

It's funny the older shows didn't use a really period sound for the backround incidental (so it's not like in 70's funk or 60's pop) but in the JNT years that 80's synth sound just resonates (and not in a good way) the time it was made.

I kept having to remind myself this is who and I shouldn't be looking for Rutger Hauer in bladerunner or Tim Thomerson in trancers

[bobws]

Yes as soon as someone tries to bring something up-to-date, they immediately put in squre in the then and now! instead of being timeless it becomes rooted in when it was made. Now , since a lot of us look back to the 80's and laugh... that just set's up poor 80's Doctor Who for dissappoinment.

But i still love it ALL!!!!!!!!!!!

[jds1911a1]

I love it but as an era I was always unhappy with JNT's run. I will be interested as I progress into the later JNT years if it keeps such a dated feel. in my memory I was always most diappointed by the 80-82 seasons but part of that I suppose was losing K9, Romana2, and then Tom

[palitoy]

Just rewatched the first episode of "Castrovolva" last night, I really hated a lot about it, the regeneration, the pacing and Ainely's Master is just so over the top.

There are some things JNT did right but he's also the reason I quit the show for a while. He really didn't have me until McCoy's second season.

[Mikey]

For the JNT era incidental music, I think the McCoy years are the absolute worst for being dated ... The use of the "orchestral hit" effect is the most embarrassing to watch now.

Castrovalva was crazy boring ...
To me all Davison's are boring (not including The Five Doctors)
To be honest, I think just about all of the JNT years were boring all the way from Tom's last season up to The Trial of a Time Lord ... The McCoy years seemed to be a little better.

[palitoy]

BBC kids have been rerunning the Davison years and I've been recording them. I am pretty sure they don't run "Earthshock" because I've never caught it or the Daleks story (which I recall as being awful).

It's very hit or miss, I really like things like "The Visitation" and "Caves of Androzani" but I'm sorry, "Kinda" still has me napping. Every season of Doctor Who has some clinkers, even today but I didn't find as many high points during these years.

I've ruined the series for my wife, she never noticed the celery, now she can't not look at it. That explaination of why he wears it is really angering.

[Mikey]

I still can't understand why Caves of Androzani is so beloved by many fans ... To me it seems like a throw together story thats extremely slow moving ... Evil dude with face mask has the hots for Peri ... The Doctor gives up his life to save her ... and one and one half hours of cave creeping around in between.

Earthshock was ok, but even that was paced very bad ...
Part-1 of Earthshock was almost impossible to watch without falling asleep.

I did like the Visitation, but I think if it was condenced into a 2 part story it would have been much better.

After getting used to the current Eccleston/Tennant style of stories (mostly 1 hour stories) when I watch many classic stories I can't help but see how badly they were padded - almost to tedium.

Compared to the New Series, JNT's saving grace was having some companions not from Earth and not from current Earth ..
JNT had ... Romana (in his first season), Adric, Nyssa, and Companion.
RTD had nobody ... unless you want to count Jack.

[palitoy]

I still can't understand why Caves of Androzani is so beloved by many fans ... To me it seems like a throw together story thats extremely slow moving ... Evil dude with face mask has the hots for Peri ... The Doctor gives up his life to save her ... and one and one half hours of cave creeping around in between.

I think I like it because it's closer to a classic Who story than we usually saw during the Davison years. The monster in that piece is straight out of Irwin Allen though..

Compared to the New Series, JNT's saving grace was having some companions not from Earth and not from current Earth ..
JNT had ... Romana (in his first season), Adric, Nyssa, and Companion.
RTD had nobody ... unless you want to count Jack.

While I do think that was a good idea, I was never fond of the posse he amassed in the Tardis. It's like JNT wanted to surround Davison with people like they did in the Hartnell years, that group dynamic didn't gel for me.

[Mikey]

I would have liked the Davison multicompanion era a lot better if JNT got better characters.

We had Nyssa and Adric both as the "smart one" and also both as the "child"

Tegan, I still haven't figured out why the Doctor wanted her as a companion ... She was always in a bad mood and acted like she didn't want to be there...

Turlough forget it ...
Why would the Doctor want Turlough as a companion ?
It doesn't make sense.

A lot of people put Peri down as the companion with the boobs ... but I think she was the best companion of all (of the Davison era).

[palitoy]

Yeah, Tegan really comes across as a jerk in reflection and you're right about Adric/Nyssa they kind of countered each other out a little. No contest as to who was the more appealing, if my wife sees Adric she makes this "ech" noise.

[jds1911a1]

Yeah, Tegan really comes across as a jerk in reflection and you're right about Adric/Nyssa they kind of countered each other out a little. No contest as to who was the more appealing, if my wife sees Adric she makes this "ech" noise.

I for one was very happy the first time I saw ep 4 of eathshock that he was gone

[jds1911a1]

BBC kids have been rerunning the Davison years and I've been recording them. I am pretty sure they don't run "Earthshock" because I've never caught it or the Daleks story (which I recall as being awful).

It's very hit or miss, I really like things like "The Visitation" and "Caves of Androzani" but I'm sorry, "Kinda" still has me napping. Every season of Doctor Who has some clinkers, even today but I didn't find as many high points during these years.

I've ruined the series for my wife, she never noticed the celery, now she can't not look at it. That explaination of why he wears it is really angering.

Kinda is really bad and it gets a sequel with snakedance (there's a futre dvd release combo for you)

Since earthshock and resuraction of the daleks are on dvd it is possible they won't air them.

I can't say what version you saw up north back then but when my PBS first got Resurection it was missing sound effects (I know assume this was a mistake from the bbc in sending a WIP '71 edit out instead of the final show) but it became a rally cry for all that was wrong with who at the time amongst my whomanoid chums

[jds1911a1]

I still can't understand why Caves of Androzani is so beloved by many fans ... To me it seems like a throw together story thats extremely slow moving ... Evil dude with face mask has the hots for Peri ... The Doctor gives up his life to save her ... and one and one half hours of cave creeping around in between.

Earthshock was ok, but even that was paced very bad ...
Part-1 of Earthshock was almost impossible to watch without falling asleep.

I did like the Visitation, but I think if it was condenced into a 2 part story it would have been much better.

After getting used to the current Eccleston/Tennant style of stories (mostly 1 hour stories) when I watch many classic stories I can't help but see how badly they were padded - almost to tedium.

Compared to the New Series, JNT's saving grace was having some companions not from Earth and not from current Earth ..
JNT had ... Romana (in his first season), Adric, Nyssa, and Companion.
RTD had nobody ... unless you want to count Jack.

True when you watch the 4 parter straight it feels padded but if you wathc a mutiparrt modern one in one sitting (Say daleks in manhattan or the series 4 finale 2 parter) it feels just as padded (Like it was supposed to be a 90 minute special but they had to make it 2 hrs since it was in season)

[Mikey]

I for one was very happy the first time I saw ep 4 of eathshock that he was gone

I never understood why the Doctor didn't go back and save Adric ...
Yes, people didn't like Adric and it was a way of getting rid of his character, but looking at it from the story's point of view the Doctor not rescuing him made Dr Who look kind of ... callous ?

There's no way Adric's death could be one of the few instances where he must die to preserve time (like Waters of Mars).

The Doctor seems to have the idea that Adric would have wanted it like this... Are you sure, Doctor ?
We're talking about the same kid who wants to go home every second episode and then changes his mind a by the time the episode ends.

If a very young man was standing on the edge of a tall building ready to jump, would you not try and talk him out of it because you felt -- he wants it like this ?

I always thought Adric's death was handled very poorly.
Appeasing the fans by killing him is one thing, but at least give it some serious thought on how to handle it.

IMO, Adric's death marks about the point when the JNT "Davison era" jumped the shark and started moving into the Colin anything-goes era.

[jds1911a1]

Adric wasn't the first time the Dr had a companion die (although it was an uncommmon occurance Katrina, Brett Vyon and Sara Kindgom in Dalek Master plan are all I can think of) His not returning was aligned with the accepted convention of "only a act of the time lords in extreme cases can allow the Dr to go back into his own timeline of events (whenever they occur chronologocally)". I don't enough of the books or audios to know if they have used paradoxes where the events of the later incarnation affect the earlier ones visit to some world other than the Genesis of the Daleks which I guess technically all later encounters with the daleks and their fear/harted are colored by a encounters earlier in the series which are chronologincally later (trying to unjumble cyber or Dalek history can give you a migrane)

actually the martyr death is better than the send off they gave some companions
Susan - forcibly left behind
Sarah - bums rush out the door
Peri - well they never did send her away properly she was just gone part way through trial
Steven - forcibly left behind at the end of the savages becuase the producer just didn't like Peter purves