Anyone have experience with nursing homes?

[Random Axe]

I'm not too far from having my father admitted into a facility. He's gotten pretty bad over the last six months with constant infections and his dementia. I just don't think my mother can take care of him, and she now thinks it too. He's the sole survivor of 11 brothers and sisters, all of whom died from alzheimers and related conditions. I saw him yesterday, and for the first time he didn't know who I was. That's kind of a soul crushing moment in one's life when a parent, especially of an only child, doesn't recognize his son.

Anyway, I've read horror stories about the government trying to seize assets and freeze bank accounts to get whatever money they can to pay for his new home. I was wondering if anyone has some experience with this sort of legality. We've already made tentative plans to funnel funds from their bank account into mine, open a new safe deposit box and store all of their vaulables and a large sum of cash in there. We might also have to sign their home over to me to keep it from being confiscated. He also has a badass truck that he'll never drive again. I'll probably have to help sell it as well.

I'm jyst curious if we're going to have to do these extreme things to preserve their livelihood and my financial future? The house is completely paid for and will be passed down to me anyway. We were hoping to get some information on how aggressive they will be during this time. Any assistance or advice would be much appreciated.

[hedrap]

If you're talking Death "Estate" Tax, it no longer exists in Ohio when passing to resident descendents. So your mom should be fine as long as the paperwork is already done, or done before he's admitted.

On the federal level, you need to cross a threshold number to file. IIRC, it's now around five million. I don't think you're playing with that kind of money, or you would have moved MegoMeet to the BelTerra. If you are looking at the kind of cash, then you are now obligated to move the Meet to BelTerra.

After that, I'm not sure your concerns. If the house is paid for, then the govt has no hand to play. Your dad needs to have an outstanding debt to the state or feds for them to call in an asset grab.

[Random Axe]

^^^See I've heard conflicting things about the house. My wife's grandparents went into a home within a month of eachother and they were about o lose their car and house, both paid off completely. They were looking to take whatevre assets they could to finance whatever medicafre does not pay for the home. THey were luckily able to sign stuff over to one of the kids, but yeah they swooped in immediately. I have no idea how their situation is compared to mine, though. I gotta do some research.

Oh and hell yeah on the Belterra. If I ever come into that kind of jack there will be legendary stories passed down for generations about the MegoMeet we have that year.

[aquaboy]

My gram was put in nursing home , insurance paid for five years, long before that they seized her home , pad locked it in all for future care. One rep was kind enough to let family in only to get pictures. If she had a living husband would not have happened. If she would have signed house to a child it wouldn't have happened I worked in nursing homes for many years , also as a mental health tech. From what I hear , most older parents (if there is only one left) sign over the house before they get to the point of being too sick , or old. This way some states can not charge up to 50% estate tax. A special needs trust can also be set , where money can be put into an account for care without worrying one greedy sister or relative can fight over funds. I wish you the best , find a good attorney , good home where your loved one can live out the reminder of their life with dignity and love. You here many horror stories , but believe me most people in health care actually do care about the people under their care !

[EMCE Hammer]

My advice - consult a lawyer

[hedrap]

I think a lawyer should be a given in all of this.

As Aqua pointed out, once you involve state/federal services, they got a hook into your finances. So if Medicare is going to pay for his nursing home, then by all means get everything squared away now. The Feds and State are b-r-o-k-e.

[hedrap]

Oh and hell yeah on the Belterra. If I ever come into that kind of jack there will be legendary stories passed down for generations about the MegoMeet we have that year.

I see lots of pics of Austin's Royal Flush Gang hanging on roulette wheels and crap tables.

[Random Axe]

I've been doing a bunch of reading and yup I needs a lawyer, probably an estate one. I'll do some searching online for a local one who can consult my mother and I. We certainly don't want any missteps with this.

[madmarva]

I've heard some really sad stories since I've been selling insurance. Yeah, Scott, get with a lawyer. It might cost a thousand or even $2,000 but it will be well worth it. My family completed a trust for my parents' assets last fall, and I was really glad to have a lawyer walk us through it. It's no fun, but when it's done, it's done and your loved ones are protected.

The laws may be different in Ohio, but in Arkansas for Medicare to pay, all the accounts must be spent down to around $1,000. Otherwise the spouse is on the line until the assets are nearly exhausted. There are proper ways to transfer the home, money and other assets to protect your mom, and there may be time mandates.

If your parents have not made final needs (funeral) plans, this would be the time to do it for both of them. As uncomfortable as it is, it is so much easier for the family to have it done before hand. Poor decisions can be made when emotions are heightened.

Also, I would suggest prepaying for the funeral through a funeral home. You should be able to lock in the price and make payments. Funeral Homes don't take payments after death. It has to be paid in full. Burial and Funeral costs run from $7 to $20,000 and up in Arkansas. Cremations with no services are $1,500 to $2,000.

Scott, my prayers are with you and your family, as always.

[Earth 2 Chris]

Geez Scott, I'm sorry to hear this. I would see a lawyer as well. I'm not sure what the laws in Kentucky are like, exactly, but I do believe there is a 5 year window on "channeling" funds from house, bank account, etc, elsewhere. In other words, you have to do it five years prior, or Medicare will still come after it. Again, this is just what I have heard, I don't have the facts on this, but it's bandied about by just about everyone I've ever talked to on the subject here. Even if that's the case, it may not be so in Ohio.

Chris

[Donkey Hoatie]

Scott,

Sorry to hear all of this. We've gone through a very similar situation with my in-laws over the past 2 years. Essentially, dementia and Parkinson's set in on my FIL and my MIL couldn't take care of him (she's nearly blind with macular degeneracy). We moved them into a home out of state, closer to my SIL and her husband (who was their financial advisor). The whole thing was very complicated, especially when you're dealing with different laws in different states.

I'll echo what most folks here have said: consult a lawyer as soon as you can. Find out what the laws are and what your choices are. Some states consider the house a protected asset. Others don't. Regardless, I'm assuming that there will have to be a spend down of non-protected assets to get below a certain threshold to qualify for state-paid care. You need to find out what qualifies and what does not qualify as soon as you can to start making plans for your mother and you to be able to walk away from the situation with as much of the estate intact as possible. The $2,000 or so you're sinking in now to a consultation could potentially save you hundreds of times that amount. It is necessary, and it is worth it.

I don't know how much time you have left with your father, but please treasure it. My FIL lasted a little over a year in assisted living before he rapidly declined. It was tragic to see such a funny, interesting guy turn into a shell of his former self with a personality that none of us recognized in the end. There will be good days and bad days along the way. The good days will surprise you. The bad days will break your heart. I'm confident you'll find the strength to withstand all the challenges life will be sending your way.

Good luck, and know the thoughts of a ton of people are with you.

[Sideshow Spock]

Geez Scott, I'm sorry to hear this. I would see a lawyer as well. I'm not sure what the laws in Kentucky are like, exactly, but I do believe there is a 5 year window on "channeling" funds from house, bank account, etc, elsewhere. In other words, you have to do it five years prior, or Medicare will still come after it. Again, this is just what I have heard, I don't have the facts on this, but it's bandied about by just about everyone I've ever talked to on the subject here. Even if that's the case, it may not be so in Ohio.

Just want to echo what Chris is saying here about the 5 year window, I've done some prelim research for my mom here in NY and this is the case as well. I know several elderly people who are still in good health yet have signed over their house to their children already so as to beat the window should something happen later.

[Random Axe]

Well, that escalated quickly. We got him in to a rehab facility this afternoon. It's not quite a nursing home, but it might become his home if he doesn't seriously improve. His medicare pays for the first 30 days, and his United Healthcare will pay for like 50 more after that is used up. That gives us some time to figure stuff out, but it looks like for a lot of the finances we're kinda on the hook. My mother is contacting an estate laywer tomorrow, the same one who drew up their wills to figure out stuff and to plan ahead as best we can. He remembered me a few times today, so that's better.

I guess this is just part of the life cycle. We were fooling ourselves thinking he would never succumb to the same things his siblings did cause he was so razor sharp until 18 months ago. Everything I learned about being a man, being responsible and respectable I learned from him. I got his value for hard work and moral compass from the example he set. It's surreal that this is the same person looking into those confused eyes. I'm going to popping in there periodically to not only check up on him but to also keep tabs on the staff. They are far less likely to ignore his needs if they don't know when we're coming to see him. They DO NOT want to get on my bad side with this.

[aquaboy]

I would also like to add my other gram from ny had a hard time . When my grampa died there was 12 living kids that had to sign off on estate. My gramma couldn't touch money , except she could pay bills that were in both their names. He never put her on any paperwork , even after 64 years of marriage and 14 kids. (2 died) . Very important to get an attorney.