The New Disney Princess

[Zemo]

Kids wouldn't know the difference when they looked at this picture. It is only adults that make the issues of this because their bored.

If people used half the energy they put into things like this, for actual issues that mattered, the world might be a better and safer place to live.

You bet!!

[Werewolf]

you guys brought up that we start complaining when they change anything on a super heroes costume but when I use the same comparison it's not the same?

Dismissing people's concerns or complaints over this IS hypocritical considering how comics fans endlessly nitpick stuff to death here. But comparing changing the shape of Batman's or Superman's insignia to the changes made to Meridia's figure is NOT a valid comparison because it does not take into the consideration the cultural concerns and issues of changing her body and appearance.

I remember a while back someone started a thread wondering why more women don't post here. I think the dismissive comments in this thread helps answer that question.

[PNGwynne]

I guess all I can say, personally, is: My little niece noticed the difference & didn't like it, and neither do I. Some here feel the changes are slight, I feel they are more substantial.

I think Hardygirl makes a good point about Disney's motives. It's okay for us, or parents, or the media, to analyze and question those motives. Just as much as we, or the media, might question DC's New 52 or Marvel's Ultimates.

[toys2cool]

you guys brought up that we start complaining when they change anything on a super heroes costume but when I use the same comparison it's not the same? It's alright i think i've stated my case, i'm a hardcore disney fan and to me it's not a big deal, my wife doesn't care and my niece laughed..so i know it's not just a guy thing...take care guys

[HardyGirl]

Thanks Hugh. But to be clear, I wasn't saying that b/c I put in my cash, I'm entitled to my POV, (I should be anyway). My point was more that Disney put out a strong character that kids and moms could embrace, and now just b/c they want to make her one of the "princesses", they want to change her appearance to what THEY believe is more princess-like. That's just plain hypocritical. Not to mention a very narrow POV. Princesses are dainty, and pretty and are to be put on a pedestal b/c of that. Baloney! And yeah, they own the character and can ultimately do whatever they want. But they need to understand that as a multi-million dollar corporation that appeals to KIDS, and has done so for decades, they need to understand the impact stuff like this has on kids. And if you think the kids don't matter (but you're crazy if you believe that), then think of the adults you're turning off by doing this. The adults who take their kids to the movies and buy your merchandise are going to be really disenchanted by a company who is so hypocritical.

[huedell]

In my honest opinion, this thread is dismissive and a little sexist.

I agree. A comment like this:

Kids wouldn't know the difference when they looked at this picture. It is only adults that make the issues of this because their bored.
If people used half the energy they put into things like this, for actual issues that mattered, the world might be a better and safer place to live.

Begs your question/statement:

I mean, in "Comics", we debate in contentiuous, minute detail every nuance of a character we love--but here this is generally perceived as "no big deal", over-reacting.

80stoyman might as well be slamming this entire board in my opinion, without literally doing that.

And then, statements like this:

How come there is never this kind of uproar when they change Mickey? Or Minnie or Daisy or whoever?

make me think that if people are this confused over the impact of this kind of issue on your typical hardcore Disney fan, then there's no explaining it to them. Why take the effort if a question like this is asked in the first place? I mean, even if you don't agree with the criticism, to not recognize the source of why this is an issue with this particular kind of character... well, I say it's a lost cause to give further explanation.

Altho', scenarios such as:

I mean, in "Comics", we debate in contentiuous, minute detail every nuance of a character we love--but here this is generally perceived as "no big deal", over-reacting.
I do think Disney's commercialism downplays more assertive princesses--where's Mulan?

that you mention are pretty self-explanatory to thie aforementioned point.

Thank you, Hugh! If you guys really thought this was "no big deal", there wouldn't be 4 pages of replies on this topic. I know it isn't as important to you as your superheroes are, (and just let someone change Superman's or Batman colors, or costume or concept, and you'd have something to say... Merida's mother accepted her for who she was and was grateful her daughter had the strength to save her. Can't Disney accept her too? That's all I'm saying.

And when HardyGirl understands that we (PNGwyne et al) understand her own POV, and then goes on to explain exactly why she feels that way, ending with the bit about Merida's Mother's acceptance of the character and it's story significance... I mean, how clear can ya get?

They've earned what? no one's earned anything, it's an opinion which everyone has a right to..you don't need to earn that.

And t2cool... I GET that... but I was just riffing on what HardyGirl had said about being a fan that's put in their cash... and, to me, that makes it that much MORE justified to have an opinion. But of course, that's just my.... um... "opinion"

The problem i see, is that it's not the little girls with the problem..It's the parents, the kids would'nt have even noticed it..I could careless if they change any super heroes costume...look at how many times the batman sign has changed and the style of costume(and many times for the better) and you don't see people opening petitions to have it go back to the original first one...It's Disney's character and their right to change it as they see fit, if you don't like the change then just don't buy the merchandize and move on..Keep on watching the original movie and you won't have this problem because the change hadn't occurred

What t2cool dismisses in the above paragraph is the fact that even if a person pretends the change didn't exist, it still doesn't affect what the criticizers see as the problem: A bad impact on society and the women within it.

It's obvious t2cool isn't getting that though because he brings up costume changes for Batman as if there's any connection between the two. Well, it should be obvious that in THIS context, there ISN'T a connection to that.

[jwyblejr]

How come there is never this kind of uproar when they change Mickey? Or Minnie or Daisy or whoever?

[RickD]

Kids wouldn't know the difference when they looked at this picture. It is only adults that make the issues of this because their bored.

If people used half the energy they put into things like this, for actual issues that mattered, the world might be a better and safer place to live.

[PNGwynne]

On showing her the Merida revamp, my 4-year old niece wanted to know why Merida didn't have her bow.

I gave her the dvd for Christmas & she loves it, pantomines archery all the time.

In my honest opinion, this thread is dismissive and a little sexist.

I mean, in "Comics", we debate in contentiuous, minute detail every nuance of a character we love--but here this is generally perceived as "no big deal", over-reacting.

I do think Disney's commercialism downplays more assertive princesses--where's Mulan?

[Werewolf]

No drastic difference and nothing to sound the alarms about.

Maybe not to you. The redesign shrunk her waist, increased her bust and lowered her neckline. I can see why those changes could be seen as troubling or a mixed message.

[VintageMike]

There's really not that much difference between the two images...it's not like one's a nun and the other is a hooker...Geez

What he said. No drastic difference and nothing to sound the alarms about.

[toys2cool]

Kids may not be able to articulate it, but they definitely pick up on these things. Ever tried to give a kid a knock-off toy? Kids are often more perceptive of the little changes than their parents.



That's precisely why this is troubling. In the movie she isn't fat or ugly, she simply looks like a "regular girl". What sort of message does it send to young girls when Disney says a normal, healthy girl is not thin enough and not pretty enough?

I totally get that, if they made her super hot and sexy i could see why maybe some would be upset..but when you can hardly tell the difference..I don't get it

[sprytel]

Are kids really going to look at this and say "Hey, they changed Merida! They made her all girly!" No, they're going to say "It's Merida!" and remember the tough, "Brave" character she was.

Kids may not be able to articulate it, but they definitely pick up on these things. Ever tried to give a kid a knock-off toy? Kids are often more perceptive of the little changes than their parents.

I just don't see that big of a difference between the before and after....I could see if it was a fat or ugly girl and then they changed her..but she was already cute..will girls even really notice the difference ??

That's precisely why this is troubling. In the movie she isn't fat or ugly, she simply looks like a "regular girl". What sort of message does it send to young girls when Disney says a normal, healthy girl is not thin enough and not pretty enough?

[jimsmegos]

Holding out for Leia.

[toys2cool]

Hey, let the women/other fans of Disney have their voice. They've earned it.

They've earned what? no one's earned anything, it's an opinion which everyone has a right to..you don't need to earn that.

The problem i see, is that it's not the little girls with the problem..It's the parents, the kids would'nt have even noticed it..I could careless if they change any super heroes costume...look at how many times the batman sign has changed and the style of costume(and many times for the better) and you don't see people opening petitions to have it go back to the original first one...It's Disney's character and their right to change it as they see fit, if you don't like the change then just don't buy the merchandize and move on..Keep on watching the original movie and you won't have this problem because the change hadn't occurred