Black Friday Tragedies

[huedell]

So what do you suggest, martial law, communism?

Jibbing Captain aside...Hector, I agree. (Still, it seems Cap actually does have
an understanding of somewhat of a balance here--- while someone like Seeker
seems to think they have the answer in black & white thought---well, Seeker,
you still have a bit to learn here)

Bottom line....
You can't rail so hard to one side without serious losses of
what makes the holiday fun. Do we want those losses for no good reason?
Of course not.

The responsibility lies not on "commercialism" but lies on the PEOPLE
----the PEOPLE who can interact/act out poorly with that part of Christmas.

Don't penalize the PEOPLE who know better and still can enjoy that
part of Christmas without squandering the goodwill towards man.

[Seeker]

Call my comment a "dumbass" comment?

Watch your step.

Maybe in some instances...but in THIS one you are utterly WRONG.

Charles Shulz was no idiot...he knew that HE HIMSELF was
part of the commercialism of Christmas---and that he was guilty of
commercialism in general with his Peanuts brood. (well, you'd have to be
an idiot NOT to realize this)

He even went so far as to have Sally comment that it ain't commercial unless
you're making money at it (in the Christmas Special sequel)---
Shulz KNEW where HIS bread was being buttered even if YOU don't.

He may have fought against commercialism blinding one to the true
meaning of holidays---but he knew and RESPECTED this process
of buoying holidays with commercial aspects
or we wouldn't have our cherished Holiday Specials to begin with.

Think before you post (and call board member's comments "dumbass").

No I totally stand by that "comment". Its sad you had to pick this topic for your usual "Point/counterpoint"game.

[Hector]

I'm not talking about completely doing away with the tradition of buying and giving gifts...Just think we need to really tone down things.

So what do you suggest, martial law, communism?

[huedell]

I'm not talking about completely doing away with the tradition of buying and giving gifts...Just think we need to really tone down things.
I dont really know who or what to blame, but to many people this season has become more about buying certain things, rather than honoring what this season is truly about (trying very carefully to keep this from becoming a religous post).
Look at the mad rushes over the years to buy certain toys, and more recently certain cell phones....I'm assuming Wal-Mart had some super cheap limited deal that caused this?
Really, who can you blame? Retailers make their money at this time of the year, and incentives help bring in the numbers. People want in on a good deal too, I get that.

Keep in mind that I was responding to the phrase you used:
"...kick the commercialism back out of Christmas."
which sounded like the extreme side of the spectrum.

I'm not surprised at your further explanation though...makes sense...
and I basically siad the same thing in my post...which is also what
Charles Schulz and the Holiday Special was trying to get across...
i.e. don't let the hubub of the more superficial aspects of Christmas
compromise the real meaning behind it....which doesn't even neccessarily
have to be interpreted as religious in nature...only what that religious event
ENCOMPASSED as far as humanity and the best of what it has to offer.

[Captain]

I have to disagree with your suggestion here.

Commercialism is an awesome part of Christmas---
even Charles Schulz would have admitted that.

Like others have already said...blame the (horrid, uneeded) deaths
on the stupidity and greed of the individuals who are responsible.

The most important part of Christmas is (admittedly) "people"
and people should remember that--yes---but NOT at
the cost of the cool gifts (food, songs, entertainment)
that come WITH Christmas.

That's "throwing out the baby with bathwater" thinking.

I'm not talking about completely doing away with the tradition of buying and giving gifts...Just think we need to really tone down things.
I dont really know who or what to blame, but to many people this season has become more about buying certain things, rather than honoring what this season is truly about (trying very carefully to keep this from becoming a religous post).
Look at the mad rushes over the years to buy certain toys, and more recently certain cell phones....I'm assuming Wal-Mart had some super cheap limited deal that caused this?
Really, who can you blame? Retailers make their money at this time of the year, and incentives help bring in the numbers. People want in on a good deal too, I get that.

[Captain]

Apparently the management at the Wal-Mart in question *did* close the store for several hours. Some of the shoppers got irate, but there was no riot:
Sought: Wal-Mart shoppers who trampled NY worker - Yahoo! News
Kimberly Cribbs, who witnessed the stampede, said shoppers were acting like "savages."

"When they were saying they had to leave, that an employee got killed, people were yelling `I've been on line since yesterday morning,'" she said. "They kept shopping."
I work for the local Wal-Mart. Yesterday was probably the largest crowd I've ever seen in the store. Thankfully, there were no injuries or major problems, but I can believe a mob of shoppers could turn ugly very easily under the right circumstances.
George

Yeah, I think shoppers can get ugly...especially this time of year. I was out for a while today, and a little old lady at Canadian Tire actually rammed a cart into somebody else because they were standing in front of something she wanted to look at. I wasnt watching long enough to know if there were events proceeding that, but it still seemed a bit much.

Didnt realize they did close the store....the news showed shoppers jostling the cops and paramedics, while trying to get by with their shopping carts...sad stuff.

[huedell]

Sad. All that to save a few bucks! Really pathetic statement on Greedy Americans!

How about greedy PEOPLE.
????

Geez

[huedell]

Umm that is a real dumbass comment. The whole point of the peanuts christmas special was knocking the over commercialism of X mas.

Schulz felt so strongly about it he put another dig about it in the Valentine special.

Call my comment a "dumbass" comment?

Watch your step.

Maybe in some instances...but in THIS one you are utterly WRONG.

Charles Shulz was no idiot...he knew that HE HIMSELF was
part of the commercialism of Christmas---and that he was guilty of
commercialism in general with his Peanuts brood. (well, you'd have to be
an idiot NOT to realize this)

He even went so far as to have Sally comment that it ain't commercial unless
you're making money at it (in the Christmas Special sequel)---
Shulz KNEW where HIS bread was being buttered even if YOU don't.

He may have fought against commercialism blinding one to the true
meaning of holidays---but he knew and RESPECTED this process
of buoying holidays with commercial aspects
or we wouldn't have our cherished Holiday Specials to begin with.

Think before you post (and call board member's comments "dumbass").

[Hotfoot]

Sad. All that to save a few bucks! Really pathetic statement on Greedy Americans!

[jessica]

Poor unfortunate souls! May they rest in peace.

Bloody savage human beasts.

[toys2cool]

people getting killed over stupid things is just ridiculous. reminds me of a friend of mine who got into a silly argument about pizza and ended up getting shot to death.

That sucks bro,you never know what nut you're going to run into out there

[ramsey37]

Horrible, horrible events....I cant even imagine wanting in a store that badly!
What really burned me was Wal-Mart not only left the store open, but people were actually stepping OVER the body and jostling the responding paramedics immediately after the incident....they showed the footage of people doing this on our local news tonight and it made me ill! I would have shut the store down right then and there.....of course then those knotheads would have rioted and caused more damage.

Apparently the management at the Wal-Mart in question *did* close the store for several hours. Some of the shoppers got irate, but there was no riot:
Sought: Wal-Mart shoppers who trampled NY worker - Yahoo! News
Kimberly Cribbs, who witnessed the stampede, said shoppers were acting like "savages."

"When they were saying they had to leave, that an employee got killed, people were yelling `I've been on line since yesterday morning,'" she said. "They kept shopping."
I work for the local Wal-Mart. Yesterday was probably the largest crowd I've ever seen in the store. Thankfully, there were no injuries or major problems, but I can believe a mob of shoppers could turn ugly very easily under the right circumstances.
George

[Seeker]

Commercialism is an awesome part of Christmas---
even Charles Schulz would have admitted that.
.

Umm that is a real dumbass comment. The whole point of the peanuts christmas special was knocking the over commercialism of X mas.

Schulz felt so strongly about it he put another dig about it in the Valentine special.

[Action Martin]

While not a tragedy, this is what I got called out for yesterday:
Black Friday bomb threat clears Wal-Mart - poconorecord.com - The Pocono Record

[huedell]

That would be Un-American, lol.

Guess who came up with the current image of Santa Claus?

The Coca-Cola Company, lol.

I agree.

And this isn't about "American" politics or "Christian" religion
or anything touchy like that.

It's about having fun. It's about "good" things.

And I'd hate to see a few bad apples ruin it for those of us
that don't deserve it.