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Did He Steal Kirby's Work OR Is It A "Tribute?"

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  • Wee67
    Museum Correspondent
    • Apr 2, 2002
    • 10603

    Did He Steal Kirby's Work OR Is It A "Tribute?"

    I'm sorry, but I'm having a little trouble buying the "tribute" explanation. Judge for yourself, but this New Yorker magazine cartoonists says he did not lift Jack Kirby's 1962 Tales to Astonish cover.


    The Full article from the New York Post-
    DRAWING CRITICISM - New York Post




    WANTED - Solid-Boxed WGSH's, C.8 or better.
  • Bizarro Amy
    Formerly known as Del
    • Dec 12, 2004
    • 3336

    #2
    The fact that the artist didn't give Kirby any credit pushes this toward "steal." However, I have to wonder, could this be seen as parody, which would cover it under Fair Use. I have my doubts though, because this was just art for a caption contest.
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    • SUP-Ronin
      Stuck in a laundry shoot.
      • Oct 8, 2007
      • 3146

      #3
      By openly crediting Kirby, it could easily be considered a tribute.

      Without credit to the original, I would call this a complete ripoff.

      The original is much better anyway, on all counts.
      "Steel-like jaws clacked away, each bite slashing flesh from my body - I used my knife and my hands, and when they were gone, my bloody stumps - and yet the turtles came."

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      • Bizarro Amy
        Formerly known as Del
        • Dec 12, 2004
        • 3336

        #4
        He probably never expected anyone who read or worked for the New Yorker to recognie it
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        • kingdom warrior
          OH JES!!
          • Jul 21, 2005
          • 12478

          #5
          The only mistake the artist made was he gave no credit to Jack......a simple after Kirby in his signiture would have taken care of it. As an Illustrator myself anytime I want pay Homage to my favorite artist I usually sign it to let the viewer know......At least the artist took from the best. He could've stolen from Rob Liefield!!! hahah

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          • Earth 2 Chris
            Verbose Member
            • Mar 7, 2004
            • 32964

            #6
            Context is the key here. In a comic book if someone did this with no credit to Kirby, the average comic fan would "get" that they were paying tribute to Kirby by the monster's design, and Kirby's name wouldn't have to be mentioned. To the general public, who aren't as familiar with most comic art conventions, I think credit should be given. If the artist is a comic and Kirby fan as he claims, he should have known most people reading the New Yorker wouldn't know about Jack Kirby or his distinctive style, or the Atlas/Marvel monster titles.

            Chris
            sigpic

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            • Bizarro Amy
              Formerly known as Del
              • Dec 12, 2004
              • 3336

              #7
              Chris makes a valid point. It's kind of like on the Simpsons, they reference comics and other media frequently, and don't always (that I've noticed) give credit. But the audience it's targeted at gets the joke and knows that it's all in good fun.
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              • Wee67
                Museum Correspondent
                • Apr 2, 2002
                • 10603

                #8
                Apparently this might not have been the first time for this artist. Here is a cartoon he had printed last month-



                And here is a cartoon a local guy has had on his website for 2 years-



                Seems to be a pattern. I imagine in an industry where you are paid per submission, there is a lot of pressure to come up with stuff.
                WANTED - Solid-Boxed WGSH's, C.8 or better.

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                • Adam West
                  Museum CPA
                  • Apr 14, 2003
                  • 6822

                  #9
                  Agreed. Even though I'm a big Jack Kirby fan, I wouldn't have noticed myself because the drawing is more obscure than most vs. doing a Kirby style Spider-Man sketch.

                  He should have mentioned his name because nobody obviously got that he was paying an homage except maybe himself.
                  "The farther we go, the more the ultimate explanation recedes from us, and all we have left is faith."
                  ~Vaclav Hlavaty

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                  • toys2cool
                    Ultimate Mego Warrior
                    • Nov 27, 2006
                    • 28605

                    #10
                    he defintely should've given him credit,what a rip off
                    "Time to nut up or shut up" -Tallahassee

                    http://ultimatewarriorcollection.webs.com/
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                    • Surfsup
                      Silver Chrome Dome
                      • Dec 2, 2005
                      • 1352

                      #11
                      Looks like a blatant rip off to me, very naughty! The least he could have done would have been to credit him like many of the artists do these days on recreated covers.

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                      • thunderbolt
                        Hi Ernie!!!
                        • Feb 15, 2004
                        • 34211

                        #12
                        Looks like one for the swipe file
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                        • LadyZod
                          Superman's Gal Pal
                          • Jan 27, 2007
                          • 1803

                          #13
                          Has anyone emailed the New Yorker the two pics side by side?

                          I hear they are VERY strict about plagerism.
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                          • The Toyroom
                            The Packaging King
                            • Dec 31, 2004
                            • 16653

                            #14
                            It's a swipe...and because it's done outside of the comic book industry (where it's usually done as a tribute or homage) it's an outright steal! Freakin' hack!
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                            • The Toyroom
                              The Packaging King
                              • Dec 31, 2004
                              • 16653

                              #15
                              Furthermore....

                              "Harry did it with all good intentions. He thought it was an overt reference, and not an attempt to plagiarize. He thought it was a tribute," Cassanos said. "To people in the comic world, it's a recognizable image."
                              It is NOT an overt reference...if it was Spidey or The Hulk or the FF then it would be. And as far as it being recognizable to people in the comics world, I consider myself a pretty knowledgeable fan but I certainly don't have all of the covers to the Atlas/Marvel monster books committed to memory as I do with other iconic images (like "Amazing Fantasy" #15, "Action Comics" #1, etc.)
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