Hero against Hero...does anyone else NOT like this trend?

[HardyGirl]

OK, so you all know I'm a little green when it comes to the modern-day comic book world. But I do know who the Avengers are, and the Justice League and World's Finest. Is the comic book industry just running out of ideas for foes, that now they have to pit hero again hero? Leave it to me to go against the grain, but to me, this is the antithesis of what superheroes are supposed to be. I saw the first 2 Captain America movies, but I declined to see the "Civil War" movie yesterday when I found out he was supposed to go up against Iron-Man. And don't get me started on Batman Vs. Superman. I'm a big fan of the World's Finest series, and simply HATE this concept.

Does anyone else agree w/ me?

[Blue Meanie]

I bowed out of comics just before the Civil War series. It is an older storyline. Doesn't bother me because all of the books I read from the 70's up have had at least one story in each run that have pitted hero against hero. Avengers Vs. Defenders/Justice League vs. JSA/X-Men vs Everyone in the Marvel Universe. Mind you until the last 20 years or so of comics they didn't make whole series out of it. Although, there have been mini series like Contest Of Champions and Secret Wars back in the 80's. So it really doesn't bother me at all. As long as they stick close to the source material I'm fine with it.

[samurainoir]

Given that it's a HUGE trope in traditional superhero comics for Heroes to meet, misunderstand, fight, and then unite against a common foe, I'm okay with it.

I don't think it really worked in Batman V. Superman due to a weak script, but with Marvel's track record I have high hopes for Civil War.

Daredevil facing off against the Punisher was perfect for the themes of the show, particularly since it has always been about Law vs Justice and now it's added the dimension of Law vs Justice vs Punishment.

I have to say, it was refreshing and kind of a delight to see Supergirl and Flash hit if off so well and become BFF's immediately.

[emeraldknight47]

I've been reading comics since I was about five (way back in 1969) and for as long as I remember, there have always been tales or arcs featuring hero vs. hero. In most cases, it's been a case of one hero being under the control of some nefarious evil-doer, the heroes being forced into confrontation by the machinations of someone with an agenda or the two heroes simply having a difference of opinion/approach to justice. I've never thought of the confrontation as making either of the heroes "the villain," I just enjoyed watching two of my favorites heroes get into a rousing brawl. By the end, they've usually cleared up their differences or motivational factors that had them fighting in the first place. Some of the best "hero v hero" stories I enjoy have been:

THOR v HERCULES - THOR #126 in which Thor and Hercules get into a skirmish, by and large, over Jane Foster.

SPIDER-MAN v THE HULK - SPIDER-MAN #119, 120 in which Webhead and ol' Greenskin go toe to toe in Canada.

SPIDER-MAN v LUKE CAGE - SPIDER-MAN #123 in which Spidey and Luke Cage comes to blows because Cage is operating under the assumption that Spidey is guilty for the murder of Captain Stacy.

SUPERMAN v SPIDER-MAN - The heavy hitter of all hero vs. hero brawls, all due to the machinations of both Lex Luthor and Doc Ock.

THOR v IRON MAN - THOR #2 (Nu-Thor) - Thor puts the smackdown on Shellhead when he finds out that Tony Stark was one of the people instrumental in creating a clone of Thor.

And, of course, all of the fights and disagreements that spun out of CIVIL WAR, a book I didn't follow.

Sometimes it's just fun to see our heroes go toe-to-toe, just to see who comes out on top.

[jwyblejr]

If it wasn't for the hero vs. hero thing,we'd have no Avengers comic.

[daz71]

i used to love the hero vs hero in the 60s/70s comics.good to see who comes out on top in fights that you have often wondered about.
thor vs hercules happened a few times they usually ended up a draw.i would have liked to see thor vs silver surfer and hercules vs wonder man back then.

[clemso]

I don't know about DC but in Marvel comics Hero v hero has always been an event, sometimes just a cross over was a event, but they always manage to find some excuse to have a punch up before they found out who the real villain was behind the shenanigans.
My favourite hero v hero was Fantastic Four 25 & 26. Hulk v Thing (& FF) and then v Avengers as well. The trouble is that fighting between heroes doesn't really translate very well as live action unless there is a blur in what you think a hero is. It worked in DD with him fighting the Punisher.

OK, so you all know I'm a little green when it comes to the modern-day comic book world. But I do know who the Avengers are, and the Justice League and World's Finest. Is the comic book industry just running out of ideas for foes, that now they have to pit hero again hero? Leave it to me to go against the grain, but to me, this is the antithesis of what superheroes are supposed to be. I saw the first 2 Captain America movies, but I declined to see the "Civil War" movie yesterday when I found out he was supposed to go up against Iron-Man. And don't get me started on Batman Vs. Superman. I'm a big fan of the World's Finest series, and simply HATE this concept.

Does anyone else agree w/ me?

[Marvelmania]

I don't know about DC but in Marvel comics Hero v hero has always been an event, sometimes just a cross over was a event, but they always manage to find some excuse to have a punch up before they found out who the real villain was behind the shenanigans.
My favourite hero v hero was Fantastic Four 25 & 26. Hulk v Thing (& FF) and then v Avengers as well. The trouble is that fighting between heroes doesn't really translate very well as live action unless there is a blur in what you think a hero is. It worked in DD with him fighting the Punisher.

FF #25 & #26 are two of the best comics ever IMHO!!!!! Just the covers alone are fantastic. A close second would be Defenders #11 Thor vs Hulk. Yeah it doesn't bother me when they all end up pals again when it's over.

[Earth 2 Chris]

It's earned in Civil War. The Marvel heroes traditionally fight first, and make friends later. And actual idealogical differences have been developing ever since Avengers, so I have no problem with it here. I think we need to be done with this after this one, for the most part, as far as making it the big theme of the film.

Superman and Batman HAVE had many, MANY stories where they turned on each other. Usually it was a ruse, or a mind-control plot, robots, etc. In the early 80s they disagreed over Batman leaving the JLA and forming the Outsiders, but they made up. And then Frank Miller happened. And suddenly they had to be at odds, although other creators slowly, VERY slowly thawed out the cold war between them.

BUT, I still think BvS made a HUGE mistake making their first film together have them at odds. It wasn't earned in the franchise, and to the average moviegoers, they just didn't get why they'd be at each other.

Chris

[clemso]

Agreed, the Defenders v Avengers storyline was one of my all time favourites. Also concur on the Kirby art covers for FF 25/26

FF #25 & #26 are two of the best comics ever IMHO!!!!! Just the covers alone are fantastic. A close second would be Defenders #11 Thor vs Hulk. Yeah it doesn't bother me when they all end up pals again when it's over.

[huedell]

As a child, the Challenge Of The Superfriends episodes where truces were made blew my child mind... as an adult I can see different iterations of this same.... as samrai said, the plots aren't really about the fights---the fights are just what sells them.

It's the "making up" (and the nuanced ways of compromise) that defines these stories. It help defines the characters better---and, more simply, gives the writers more cool stuff to write about.

Ever hear the saying "A hero is only as good as villain"----well, with this trope, now you can have any awesome hero as the (temporary) villain.

In a perfect world---no one would fight.

In a perfect DRAMATIC world----EVERYONE fights----it's more fun that way

[LonnieFisher]

It's not a trend, it's a staple!

[EMCE Hammer]

I don't know about DC but in Marvel comics Hero v hero has always been an event, sometimes just a cross over was a event, but they always manage to find some excuse to have a punch up before they found out who the real villain was behind the shenanigans.
My favourite hero v hero was Fantastic Four 25 & 26. Hulk v Thing (& FF) and then v Avengers as well. The trouble is that fighting between heroes doesn't really translate very well as live action unless there is a blur in what you think a hero is. It worked in DD with him fighting the Punisher.

It seemed a little more benign in the 70s. Nowadays for me it's about the execution of the concept. Marvel=good; DC=sloppy and contrived.

[samurainoir]

Ant Man vs Falcon was a fun little scene that really worked in the context of the story. It also "mattered" as a build-up to Civil War. Again, playing on the "misunderstanding" trop.

The one I'm REALLY looking forward to though is Hulk Vs Thor. Particularly if it is in fact a partial adaptation/homage to Planet Hulk. An outer space Gladitorial arena seems like the perfect contrivance to pit these two against each other in what will no doubt be a special effects spectacle extravaganza