Is Alex Ross Overrated now?

[kingdom warrior]

I was in midtown comics the other in NYC killing time before i had to go to a meeting. I had not been in a comic shop in months because i had decided not to buy any comics for the time being. I came across Kingdom come Special number one and since I had read the original run i decided to buy it.

While i was at the shop I looked at the other projects he was involved with.

SuperPowers, Avengers/Invaders and whatever covers he's done for DC. Now I've been a big Fan over the years with his work...but when he did that 12 issue run with the justice league it left me a bit disappointed.

To be honest his work is starting to look the same. I see the same poses over and over....and just not exciting anymore.

Now I took the Kingdom Come special and read it. It was his first time writing and inking his own work...

I wasn't crazy about it. Nor did I like the computer coloring over his inked halftones. I looked at his thumbnails which were great but i sat there and couldn't understand why he needs to shoot photo reference after that.

Then he put a disclaimer that he draws the pictures by eye and not lightboxed or projected which honestly i don't care how he does it. Norman Rockwell who Ross is like. Projected and traced over his photographs to make some of the greatest paintings ever.

So anyway I was thinking Ross has made his mark on the industry no doubt. But unlike the legends of the industry such as Kirby and Neal Adams, Eisner He's constantly reworking another masters vision...and Yes it's great but does that make him a true Master of the medium or is he just a really good painter who paints other peoples Ideas and Superheroes?

My Question do you think he's overated or not?

[huedell]

After seeing your thread I just wanted to say something quickly.

I am not a comicbook buyer (except on rare occasions) but have a
big respect for the comicbook culture because, after all, it's where
all my favorite heroes and villains exist in the first place!

When Ross came on the scene years ago---to a guy like me---
it was apparent he didn't JUST have a love for the comicbook medium
but also---he had a love for the ICON aspect of superhero imagery
and particularly a love for the DC heroes (and villains)
and their image from when I was a kid...Silver/Bronze Age.

I was grateful to Ross to see him bring my favorite heroes and villains to life--
(particularly 2nd tier DC VILLAINS) in the way that only "he" could
because presumably there's really not many other artists out there who can
produce the realistic type art that he does at the rate that he does...
at least in the DCU part of the comicbook industry.

It's because of this ^^^ that no matter what stupid ideas he may come up
with...no matter how stale his style might become...I'll always have a certain
kind of respect for him that makes the term "overrated" seem impossible...
kinda like my feelings towards MICHAEL JACKSON (or close anyway)
--I'd refuse to call JACKSON "overrated" mainly because of stuff he did
when he was a pioneer and he undeniably was a pop culture favorite.

Apologies for the rant...because it maybe answers your question but,
as you can tell, I'm not really "qualified" to give an opinion that takes into
consideration his full body of work, 2008 or otherwise.

I just think his contribution to the industry was immense
----and his pictures are cool!

[The Toyroom]

At this point I'd have to agree with you...I was a big Alex Ross mark before but lately it seems as though companies think that simply by attaching his name to a project it'll be a smash.

I bought the first arc of Project Superpowers and have been disappointed pretty much from day one....besides Ross' covers and his sketches in the back of the book the rest has been an incoherrent mess as far as I'm concerned. Now granted, he's not reposnible for the sub-par (IMO) interior artwork but he IS involved with the plotting of the story and that's sucked.

Same thing with Avengers/Invaders....pretty covers and not much else. Half way through this story and NOTHING has happened except constant battles between both factions and not a lot of substance.

On the other hand, I actually enjoyed his recent Kingdom Come Superman Special. For his first stab at writing a full script instead of just contributing story beats and plot points I didn't think it was that bad. And even though the artwork wasn't his usual full-on paint job I thought it was still 1000 times better than some of the other crap guys in the industry are putting on the stands these days.

I think his point about the photo references and NOT using a lightbox to trace was a jab at guys like Greg Land, who aren't very subtle about their use of lightboxing over other people's artwork and photos. At least Ross is still doing the deed himself and shooting his own film and using that as reference for his pencils.

As far as originality of ideas..yeah Ross is milking a lot of wells dry with his constant rehashing. But there's a lot of that going around these days. I just think we tend to notice more with him because they're always "Alex Ross" projects and not "Dan DiDio" projects. I think he needs to stop trying to come up with the next "Marvels" or "Kingdom Come" or even "Justice"...i.e. these massive projects with the cast of thousands mentality. What works for George Perez doesn't work for everybody. But he's been soooooo identified with these types of stories it's what I think people tend to expect from him.

[kingdom warrior]

No That's fine Hue. The rant is fine i was ranting myself I just want to hear other people's thoughts on this I don't think you have to be a comic buyer to appreciate his work.

[kingdom warrior]

At this point I'd have to agree with you...I was a big Alex Ross mark before but lately it seems as though companies think that simply by attaching his name to a project it'll be a smash.

I bought the first arc of Project Superpowers and have been disappointed pretty much from day one....besides Ross' covers and his sketches in the back of the book the rest has been an incoherrent mess as far as I'm concerned. Now granted, he's not reposnible for the sub-par (IMO) interior artwork but he IS involved with the plotting of the story and that's sucked.

Same thing with Avengers/Invaders....pretty covers and not much else. Half way through this story and NOTHING has happened except constant battles between both factions and not a lot of substance.

On the other hand, I actually enjoyed his recent Kingdom Come Superman Special. For his first stab at writing a full script instead of just contributing story beats and plot points I didn't think it was that bad. And even though the artwork wasn't his usual full-on paint job I thought it was still 1000 times better than some of the other crap guys in the industry are putting on the stands these days.

I think his point about the photo references and NOT using a lightbox to trace was a jab at guys like Greg Land, who aren't very subtle about their use of lightboxing over other people's artwork and photos. At least Ross is still doing the deed himself and shooting his own film and using that as reference for his pencils.

As far as originality of ideas..yeah Ross is milking a lot of wells dry with his constant rehashing. But there's a lot of that going around these days. I just think we tend to notice more with him because they're always "Alex Ross" projects and not "Dan DiDio" projects. I think he needs to stop trying to come up with the next "Marvels" or "Kingdom Come" or even "Justice"...i.e. these massive projects with the cast of thousands mentality. What works for George Perez doesn't work for everybody. But he's been soooooo identified with these types of stories it's what I think people tend to expect from him.

Bingo!!!!! You hit exactly what i was thinking except you typed it better. I was so disappointed with his Avengers/Invaders and i had high hopes for Superpowers. Ah Yes! Greg Land and the latest crop of marvel Artist who use too much photo reference that seems to make the work look a bit stiff

[kingdom warrior]

The thing with George Perez is he can actually draw all those heros without photo reference and get the book out in time. where I constantly see Ross doing it. Bryan Hitch,Greg Land,David Mack and many of the newer Marvel artist. It's become the norm.

Where the older artist could draw without it and have an identifiable style. lately I can't tell who's who.

[thunderbolt]

I've actually enjoyed Superpowers way more than Justice (which I gave up on around 6 or 7). Nice seeing his take on these forgotten characters. Avengers/Invaders I skipped since it featured the "New" Avengers line up. Bleechh.

[BlackKnight]

Ross's Painting Skills Being Over Rated ?

My Answer No. I can look at his Art Work forever & a Lifetime.

Ross's Writing & Story Work being over Rated ?

My Answer is Yes. Perhaps He just Shouldn't get involved in the Writing Aspects of Comics imo,.. Leave that to Johnn's. I mean,.. the Whole 2 Yr Build up story incline to Justice,.. resulted in Nothing & me Not caring after reading it.... I feel as if I wasted something....

Ross's Creating New Costumes for Already Established Trade Marketed HouseHold Names Like Captain America & Batman Being over Rated ?

That Question,.. only leaves me with a 1 word thought Retorical Question in Response..... WHY ???

[ctc]

>his work is starting to look the same. I see the same poses over and over....and just not exciting anymore.

The problem is, he does superheroes. Period. And he has a definite view of the right way to do them. Period. So he's been doing the exact same thing since the 90's. He's very good at ti, but the fans get fatigued 'cos of the repetition.

It happens to a lot of big name mainstream cartoonists; I suspect for the same reason.

Don C.

[MIB41]

Alex Ross has clearly redefined the landscape of comics and the marketing thereof. I think that qualifies him to be considered among the best.

[palitoy]

I agree with most folks here and can't get into his writing, I love his art (when he's not being worn thin like in Justice) but I wouldn't put my name on SuperPowers.

[johnnystorm]

I don't think he's overrated, more like over exposed. When he first hit the scene it was a Ross project every few years, a Wizard cover, a lithograph print here & there. Now he's on EVERYTHING: Project Superpowers and all the spin-offs, Superman covers, JSA covers and some interiors, assorted variant covers (mostly for Dynamite), Avengers/Invaders, Captain America , Justice, HEROES, Flash Gordon figures...etc, etc.

He should take a break for awhile and reemerge as a specialty artist again.

On the other hand, he's making money and one should never turn that away, so I can't really blame him. And so far, I don't think he's caused any delays in production because of his workload. And if his work has suffered a bit because of it it really hasn't shown...even BAD Alex Ross is better than about 75% of what's out there (BLUEWATER COMICS, I'M TALKIN' TO YOU HERE).

[kingdom warrior]

^^^^^ No Doubt he has the Hot hand and of course you have to make your money in the comic biz otherwise you will be taken advantage of. I agree I think it may be overexposure...but at the same time I just see that same type of pose over and over. The looking up heroically or Flying up poses that he seems to do over and over again.....It's just me.

[Earth 2 Chris]

I agree with the over-exposed part. I think Ross is best on covers and short minis, with series spread out over several years. Basically like the first 10 years of his comic career. I don't care for the extreme color palette he seems to have switched to for most of his current covers either.

Ross is a fantastic artist, but like many before him, his innovations have brought their own set of problems to comics. Like Dark Knight and Watchmen inspired every writer going to deconstruct the super hero, Ross' painted style has caused many to abandon the basic framework of comic illustration. Unfortunately much of the storytelling went with it. Much of today's comic art should be credited to Adobe Photoshop effects and filters, rather than true artistic talent. The days of spotted blacks and bold layouts are all but gone. I feel a lot of this is a direct response to lesser artists trying to emulate Ross the easy way.

Chris

[jemboy2004]

I love most of Ross's art except I don't care for his Wonder Woman. I'm not sure why there is something I don't like about her, otherwise I love his work.

I didn't get his super powers as I never noticed it but am curious about it now. I'll have to look at it next time I'm in a comic shop.

His Justice I liked and his new one shots I thought were good. His earlier work is some of my favorite comics ever.