Missed opportunity with New 52?

[madmarva]

I always thought Central City was Kansas City. Coast City was L.A. Again, I think the fictional locals brings story potential. DC never would have destroyed L.A. In a comic, but with Coast City as a surrogate for or coexisting with L.A., then it became the spark for Emerald Twilight. The same with the No Man's Land storyline with its earthquake destroying Gotham And when Brainiac's influence amped up the technology in Metropolis beyond the norm in the DC Universe.

As for Marvel's New York setting being a grounding mechanism for readers, it's true for some but maybe not for others. For readers who have never or only rarely visited New York City and don't really have a feel for the difference between Queens and Hell's Kitchen or the Bronx and Manhattan, I don't think the setting is as meaningful to those who are.

[thunderbolt]

I recall that Central City was initially in Southern Ohio, & DC reconned it west in the later '70s.

Perhaps I'm just biased as a Buckeye, but I always felt Barry Allan had the right work ethic & temperament to be an Ohioan.

In New Frontier he's referred to as the Illinois Flash, so maybe Central City was Chicago or Peoria.

[boynightwing]

It seems in the last few months, Nightwing has moved to Chicago so we'll see how that goes.

[PNGwynne]

I recall that Central City was initially in Southern Ohio, & DC reconned it west in the later '70s.

Perhaps I'm just biased as a Buckeye, but I always felt Barry Allan had the right work ethic & temperament to be an Ohioan.

[hedrap]

The Atlas of the DCU has entries that explicitly list the home states of some of the fictional cities, like Central City, Missouri / Ivy Town, Connecticut / Midway City, Michigan and Star City, California. But it does NOT list the states for Gotham or Metropolis. But if you go by the enclosed maps, Gotham is in New Jersey, and Metropolis is in Delaware!

Chris

That is ridiculous.

I never understood why they didn't make L.A, Metropolis with the Byrne reboot. It would have made total sense from a climate and geography position. Keeping him on the east coast, near Batman, diminishes his stature. It way Keystone always made sense to be in Indiana; Flash can get anywhere, instantly.

[ctc]

>I feel that's always been part of what holds DC back. Their characters are more archetypes than actual characters, and that makes them less relatable to both readers and moviegoers.

It does hold them back' but not 'cos of anything inherent to the idea. It's more difficult to work with the bigger thsn life characters 'cos you can't fall back on the old audience sympathy tropes as readily. You have to concieve of the characters as something unique before the plots. Sure, SUperman is Clark Kent; but it'd be tough to do a Kent based book 'cos you'sd still KNOW Supes was under there somehow, and after the sixth time he got chewed up for being late you'd start wondering why he didn't just fly in, or quit, or reverse time.... People would start asking awkward questions, and you'd have to start making with the awkward answers.

On the other hand, people will give a more iconic character a LOT more slack in the reality division, provided you're meeting their expectations with larger than life stories. Marvel gets away with it 'cos the idea of heroes as people was part of the conceptualization of their characters. It's subliminal, and plays off expectations. Peter Parker getting chewed out by Jameson = business as usual. Clark Kent getting chewed out by Perry White = why does he put up with this? He doesn't need the job.

>I thought Detroit would make a good city for Batman.

They tried something like that back in the 80's with the Justice League. Probelm is; Detroit is like any other city: a mix of people, areas, businesses.... what you get in comics is a weird shorthand. Detroit REALLY suffers from that; often coming across as a weird synthesis of the Road Warrior and a Michael Jackson video. It alienates readers FROM the D, and it can cause all sorts of problems conceptually if the city suddenly gets notoriety for something in real life. ESPECIALLY something removed from the presentation you've decided to go with in the comic. (So.... would we have shots of Batman perched, pensively on the proposed Robocop statue?) It's better overall to make a city LIKE the image you wish to portray and go with that.

It goes with the preceeding idea; Marvel gets away with it 'cos it was built into their universe very early on. (Issue 2 or 3 of the FF, I believe.) And even THEN, Marvel Universe New York must have a supervillain density of one per block.

Don C.

[Earth 2 Chris]

The Atlas of the DCU has entries that explicitly list the home states of some of the fictional cities, like Central City, Missouri / Ivy Town, Connecticut / Midway City, Michigan and Star City, California. But it does NOT list the states for Gotham or Metropolis. But if you go by the enclosed maps, Gotham is in New Jersey, and Metropolis is in Delaware!

Chris

[madmarva]

There was an issue of the 1970s in-house fanzine The Amazing World of DC Comics which said which cities the DC versions were based on or at least what states.

I'm sure someone on the board probably remembers those cities. There was also an Atlas of the DC cities printed for role playing games.

[Bionicfanboy66]

I've heard that Metropolis was loosely modeled after Minneapolis.

[Bionicfanboy66]

^I suspect there are a lot of fans like you and boynightwing out there, and that's probably why DC has never changed it.

I thought Detroit would make a good city for Batman. It's about as crime ridden as you can get, and the architecture sure fits.
Part modern, part industrial graveyard.

Or Chicago, which has been known to have more killings and other criminal activity than either LA or NYC.

[Bionicfanboy66]

Marvel Comics Group was based in NYC. Write what you know about.

[ShadowAvenger]

I always liked the concept that Metropolis is NYC during the day while Gotham City is NYC during the night. The one thing that I never liked about Marvel was that almost every superhero seemed to be base in NYC.

[enyawd72]

^I can appreciate your POV. I never really thought of the DC cities as characters unto themselves, but I guess I could see that especially with Batman. Would you say he's a product of his environment?

These are the kinds of discussions I enjoy here, with well thought out responses and views from all parties...thanks to everyone who posted.

[madmarva]

To give an example...I feel like I know Peter Parker. He's like a real person to me. Yet, as much as I like Batman and Superman, I've never felt that way about either of them. I feel detached from them both, and the fact they live in places that don't exist doesn't help.

Enyawd72, I respect that the above is the way you feel, but others may feel that Clark Kent or Bruce Wayne or Dick Grayson or Hal Jordan are more enjoyable or relatable to them than Peter Parker or Bruce Banner or Tony Stark. Your points are subjective.

While you like Spider-Man because the character has more trappings of reality, I like Spidey because he can climb up walls, pick up a car, develop web shooters and webs overnight in his room. What I find tedious about Spider-Man, particularly Stan Lee and Gerry Conway scripted stories - which I freely admit are classics and were somewhat revolutionary in terms of comic book storytelling -is the hangdog, why me, never-catch-a-break vibe. Now, that's just me. If you take take that melodrama away, I totally admit it wouldn't be Spider-man or at least not the same. Similarly if you take Gotham or Metropolis away Batman or Superman, you take something vital from the characters.

Do you take Bilbo out of Middle Earth or Alice out of Wonderland or Aslan out of Narnia? I don't think so. Nor do you rewrite The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn to name the Mississippi River, Freedom River.

But I've read other people argue the same topic In fanzines and books before and while I see the point, I think such a change would hurt the characters and the brands more than it would help.

But everyone has their own reasons for liking or not liking something, and their own ideas on how to improve things. And those differences keeps things interesting.

[kingdom warrior]

I disagree. Gotham and Metropolis are part of the appeal to me. To me it makes it more believable that it's happening somewhere similar to the world we live in, but not quite. An alien invasion in Metropolis is easier to swallow than one in New York, for instance.

Metropolis being close to Smallville is mostly due to sloppy writing for convenience on the Smallville series.

Chris

Yup.....Plus you then Have the Problem when something Happens, the First thing you say is, so where is so? and why is this team not responding.....

I like those cities makes it a magical place where Superheroes live....I live in the real New York, they Ain't no Spiderman webbing about......