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Star Wars Forces of Destiny dolls.

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  • Hedji
    Citizen of Gotham
    • Nov 17, 2012
    • 7246

    #61
    Originally posted by sprytel
    I think these figures are awesome. I gave my daughter a figure last week for her birthday. "Sabine! Sabine Wren!" she squealed.

    We're hoping they make a Hera to go with her.

    (Those are characters from the Star Wars Rebels cartoon for those who don't follow that sort of thing.)

    I teach 5th graders, and for anyone who thinks Star Wars is being mishandled, think again; boys and girls don't care if it's Darth Vader, Sabine Wren, Rose Tico, or Kylo Ren. It's so wonderful to be around kids whose opinions aren't tainted by internet chatter or fan rage. They are along for the ride, and loving it, as we should be, and as we were when we were their age.

    Comment

    • Werewolf
      Inhuman
      • Jul 14, 2003
      • 14615

      #62
      New episode with Mark Hamill back as the voice of Luke.

      You are a bold and courageous person, afraid of nothing. High on a hill top near your home, there stands a dilapidated old mansion. Some say the place is haunted, but you don't believe in such myths. One dark and stormy night, a light appears in the topmost window in the tower of the old house. You decide to investigate... and you never return...

      Comment

      • Hedji
        Citizen of Gotham
        • Nov 17, 2012
        • 7246

        #63
        These are delightful. Sometimes, after a busy day, this is about all my brain can take. They're almost therapeutic. I hope they are collected and released on Blu Ray, but I won't hold my breath.

        Comment

        • Nostalgiabuff
          Muddling through
          • Oct 4, 2008
          • 11290

          #64
          would be even cooler if they actually made 1/2 hour episodes to promote the toy line, or even direct to video movies ala Monster High. as long as they are of the same quality as these shorts

          Comment

          • Werewolf
            Inhuman
            • Jul 14, 2003
            • 14615

            #65
            Originally posted by Hedji
            These are delightful.
            I agree I think they are really well done. The one with Luke and Yoda made me smile.
            You are a bold and courageous person, afraid of nothing. High on a hill top near your home, there stands a dilapidated old mansion. Some say the place is haunted, but you don't believe in such myths. One dark and stormy night, a light appears in the topmost window in the tower of the old house. You decide to investigate... and you never return...

            Comment

            • Earth 2 Chris
              Verbose Member
              • Mar 7, 2004
              • 32498

              #66
              Going to watch the new ones with my girl tonight!

              Chris
              sigpic

              Comment

              • Hedji
                Citizen of Gotham
                • Nov 17, 2012
                • 7246

                #67
                I absolutely love that they aren't restrained by timeline. The variety of eras they cover is very leveling, and does a fine job of presenting the SW Universe as a broad spectrum of possible mini adventures. SW is always low hanging fruit to be the Internet's punching bag, but seeing all of these characters, all of these eras, presented with equal care and without bias is an objective reminder to old fans that kids (the target audience all along) don't discriminate; to them, it's just Star Wars. We all have preferences, but that's how I try to approach my fandom, through my kid goggles.

                Comment

                • Earth 2 Chris
                  Verbose Member
                  • Mar 7, 2004
                  • 32498

                  #68
                  Watched the new ones tonight. All are good, but the Luke one and the Leia episode that fills in how she got her Boush disguise were great!

                  Chris
                  sigpic

                  Comment

                  • patches
                    New Member
                    • Jan 12, 2015
                    • 19

                    #69
                    Originally posted by PNGwynne

                    More importantly, Forces of Destiny was specifically designed and marketed for girls.
                    Honestly? No it really wasn't. Hasbro knows how to design and sell toys to girls. Clearly none of those qualified people were involved in this product line and it shows at every step. Which is a shame, if properly managed it could have been a great line. There is nothing wrong with girls likeing Star Wars or Girls wanting Star Wars fashion dolls. But how these were designed, presented and marketed was as if by a rank amateur out to score a political point rather than use actual knowledge of the market and sales data to build a successful line. And we know it was a total flop. I know at the three Targets near my house not one doll sold until they hit deep clearance prices. Even then they only sold about 30% of their initial shelf stock. These were toys that were created to have a message, not a market.

                    If they had wanted to actually sell these they would have put them elsewhere. Ideally next to the Disney Princess stuff which they would have great synergy with. They would reflect that Girls do buy and play differently than the boys. They would have put it out there as an entirely separate product line. It's own thing, forging into new untapped marketspace. Instead they shoved it into what are traditionally the "boys aisles" with the unsubtle messaging that "Star Wars is all girls now! Tough luck boys!" (thank you Kathleen Kennedy for that bit of marketing genius) So instead of widening their core products appeal and effectively doubling it's potential market. They crammed these things into the shelf space for their current successful boys toys, taking the central spot and squeezing those out. Thus eating into their steady and existing sales, while having absolutely no potential for growth outside of a statistically immeasurable small niche population who happened to stumble across them on accident. Whoever managed this product line at Hasbro and Lucasfilms was criminally incompetent. While I am happy and hopeful that some young girls found these and fell in love with them, the sad truth is this line, much like it's Marvel Counterpart failure "Fan Girls" fashion dolls, was not targeted at kids. It was designed for and to appeal to 30 something hipsters that don't buy toys. (as opposed to most of us. 30-40 somethings that do buy toys...)

                    And the biggest tragedy is it would not have taken much to have actually made this work. Step 1 actually sell them to girls. Put them in the girls toy aisles (you know those things that we aren't supposed to have anymore, even though thats how kids actually select and buy toys?) Put them next to the Princess stuff. Better yet make them an offshoot to the princesses. Actually make them good playable toys. I don't know how many of you bought any of these things. My wife picked up a few. As toys, as girls toys they are awful. Once you open them it becomes clear that they were really designed to remain mint in packaging. Because many of the fashion accessories don't in fact fit the dolls. And even then the dolls have nothing to do. Nobody actually playtested these with kids. and it's heartbreaking. If they had done this right it would have been a huge draw for the IP as a whole. Much like Lego pulled off with their Friends line. But Lego spent 3 years and $15 million dollars on deep internal research on how kids actually play. Using thousands of kids. They mapped out what girls actually want in a toy, then sold them that toy. whereas Hasbro/Lucasfilms simply declared the "Force is Female" and assumed they would come. Forces of Destiny is a case study on how to turn a good product idea into an actual product offering so bad that it does measurable brand damage.

                    Comment

                    • MRP
                      Persistent Member
                      • Jul 19, 2016
                      • 2035

                      #70
                      Originally posted by patches
                      Honestly? No it really wasn't. Hasbro knows how to design and sell toys to girls. Clearly none of those qualified people were involved in this product line and it shows at every step. Which is a shame, if properly managed it could have been a great line. There is nothing wrong with girls likeing Star Wars or Girls wanting Star Wars fashion dolls. But how these were designed, presented and marketed was as if by a rank amateur out to score a political point rather than use actual knowledge of the market and sales data to build a successful line. And we know it was a total flop. I know at the three Targets near my house not one doll sold until they hit deep clearance prices. Even then they only sold about 30% of their initial shelf stock. These were toys that were created to have a message, not a market.

                      If they had wanted to actually sell these they would have put them elsewhere. Ideally next to the Disney Princess stuff which they would have great synergy with. They would reflect that Girls do buy and play differently than the boys. They would have put it out there as an entirely separate product line. It's own thing, forging into new untapped marketspace. Instead they shoved it into what are traditionally the "boys aisles" with the unsubtle messaging that "Star Wars is all girls now! Tough luck boys!" (thank you Kathleen Kennedy for that bit of marketing genius) So instead of widening their core products appeal and effectively doubling it's potential market. They crammed these things into the shelf space for their current successful boys toys, taking the central spot and squeezing those out. Thus eating into their steady and existing sales, while having absolutely no potential for growth outside of a statistically immeasurable small niche population who happened to stumble across them on accident. Whoever managed this product line at Hasbro and Lucasfilms was criminally incompetent. While I am happy and hopeful that some young girls found these and fell in love with them, the sad truth is this line, much like it's Marvel Counterpart failure "Fan Girls" fashion dolls, was not targeted at kids. It was designed for and to appeal to 30 something hipsters that don't buy toys. (as opposed to most of us. 30-40 somethings that do buy toys...)

                      And the biggest tragedy is it would not have taken much to have actually made this work. Step 1 actually sell them to girls. Put them in the girls toy aisles (you know those things that we aren't supposed to have anymore, even though thats how kids actually select and buy toys?) Put them next to the Princess stuff. Better yet make them an offshoot to the princesses. Actually make them good playable toys. I don't know how many of you bought any of these things. My wife picked up a few. As toys, as girls toys they are awful. Once you open them it becomes clear that they were really designed to remain mint in packaging. Because many of the fashion accessories don't in fact fit the dolls. And even then the dolls have nothing to do. Nobody actually playtested these with kids. and it's heartbreaking. If they had done this right it would have been a huge draw for the IP as a whole. Much like Lego pulled off with their Friends line. But Lego spent 3 years and $15 million dollars on deep internal research on how kids actually play. Using thousands of kids. They mapped out what girls actually want in a toy, then sold them that toy. whereas Hasbro/Lucasfilms simply declared the "Force is Female" and assumed they would come. Forces of Destiny is a case study on how to turn a good product idea into an actual product offering so bad that it does measurable brand damage.
                      I don't know where you shopped, but here in Wal Mart and other store sI saw them, they were not with the other Star Wars stuff except at TRU (which hey they made such good decisions they are going out) but in with the girls toys dolls, with the Descendants stuff, next to Monster high and DC Super Hero Girls, and they sold well there (I saw them, asked my wife if she was interested, she was, and went back to find they had sold out and had to wait for them to restock before buying the first few for her as a Christmas gift and the rest for her birthday. By the time they went to clearance, there were only a handful left and some characters ha sold out before hitting that deep discount. Not sure what Target did, our Target in this town closed about 4 years back because of poor sales and it's a half hour drive to the closest Target), but it seems where to display them was a retailer by retailer decision and not a line wide decision by Hasbro or Disney, because here where they did what you said they should, they sold well.

                      -M
                      "Opinion is the lowest form of human knowledge. It requires no accountability, no understanding." -Plato

                      Comment

                      • PNGwynne
                        Master of Fowl Play
                        • Jun 5, 2008
                        • 19444

                        #71
                        Hmmm. When I saw them in Target a while ago, they were in the "girls" aisle with the Disney toys. Admittedly, I'm more focused on Imaginext when I toy-shop.
                        WANTED: Dick Grayson SI trousers; gray AJ Mustang horse; vintage RC Batman (Bruce Wayne) head; minty Wolfman tights; mint Black Knight sword; minty Launcelot boots; Lion Rock (pale) Dracula & Mummy heads; Lion Rock Franky squared boots; Wayne Foundation blue furniture; Flash Gordon/Ming (10") unbroken holsters; CHiPs gloved arms; POTA T2 tan body; CTVT/vintage Friar Tuck robes, BBP TZ Burgess Meredith glasses.

                        Comment

                        • Falstaff13
                          Persistent Member
                          • May 28, 2008
                          • 1251

                          #72
                          I haven't really followed this line the entire time it's been out, but I first noticed it and have mostly seen it (in stores like Wal-Mart and Target) next to DC Super Hero Girls and the Descendants. In at least one Wal-Mart, these types of lines were the "transition" aisle from traditional girl toys to boys, but these lines were on their own aisle. In a Wal-Mart recently (and I looked to see, because of some of the discussion in this thread), I found one aisle had this Star Wars line (kept separate from the other action figures), Monster High, and DC Super Hero Girls all on one aisle, facing the growing number of nano metal figs and other figurines, including the Funko Pops. The figurine type stuff was separated by the various more or less, so some Star Wars were there, as well as several other options.
                          Hugh H. Davis

                          Wanted: Legends of the West (Empire & Excel) and other western historically-based figures. Send me an offer.
                          Also interested in figures based on literary characters.

                          Comment

                          • patches
                            New Member
                            • Jan 12, 2015
                            • 19

                            #73
                            Originally posted by MRP
                            I don't know where you shopped, but here in Wal Mart and other store sI saw them, they were not with the other Star Wars stuff except at TRU (which hey they made such good decisions they are going out) but in with the girls toys dolls, with the Descendants stuff, next to Monster high and DC Super Hero Girls, and they sold well there (I saw them, asked my wife if she was interested, she was, and went back to find they had sold out and had to wait for them to restock before buying the first few for her as a Christmas gift and the rest for her birthday. By the time they went to clearance, there were only a handful left and some characters ha sold out before hitting that deep discount. Not sure what Target did, our Target in this town closed about 4 years back because of poor sales and it's a half hour drive to the closest Target), but it seems where to display them was a retailer by retailer decision and not a line wide decision by Hasbro or Disney, because here where they did what you said they should, they sold well.

                            -M
                            Every store I saw them in. Target Walmart and TRU alike had them placed dead center of the "boys Toys" Star Wars aisle. Target typically had them taking up the prime center 6' dead center right under the big Star Wars sign. And I would be astonished if they moved so much as a single piece of merchandise for weeks or months. The display was always packed solid in the same display orientation. No changes. Never signs of 1 or 2 pieces being sold. Either they did instant restocks as soon as they sold one, or they were moving none. And this was in multiple stores around me. I've done retail and inventory consulting, and I tend to twig on this sort of thing. At least near me (Southeast US) these things were not moving at all. The only figure that seemed to get a little bit of interest was Sabine Wren. I'm not saying this to in any way dump on anybodies favorite toy line. The toys were actually a really neat idea. One that they should have done better with. But I don't think I have ever seen quite this bad a failure of marketing and merchandise planning as this line. If your local store had the good sense to put them over with the Disney Princess and Monster High dolls then Good For Them. They seemingly figured out how to sell them. But that would not appear to be an order that came from Hasbro product management. That was likely somebody local with an ounce of common sense. What makes it worse is we see the exact same mistake comitted with the Marvel "Fan Girl" dolls by Hasbro management. Mattel managed to pull off an upset with their DC Super Hero Girls dolls by putting them in front of girls where they can be bought. Hasbro keeps ignoring common sense rules of how shoppers actually behave.

                            Comment

                            • MRP
                              Persistent Member
                              • Jul 19, 2016
                              • 2035

                              #74
                              Originally posted by patches
                              Every store I saw them in. Target Walmart and TRU alike had them placed dead center of the "boys Toys" Star Wars aisle. Target typically had them taking up the prime center 6' dead center right under the big Star Wars sign. And I would be astonished if they moved so much as a single piece of merchandise for weeks or months. The display was always packed solid in the same display orientation. No changes. Never signs of 1 or 2 pieces being sold. Either they did instant restocks as soon as they sold one, or they were moving none. And this was in multiple stores around me. I've done retail and inventory consulting, and I tend to twig on this sort of thing. At least near me (Southeast US) these things were not moving at all. The only figure that seemed to get a little bit of interest was Sabine Wren. I'm not saying this to in any way dump on anybodies favorite toy line. The toys were actually a really neat idea. One that they should have done better with. But I don't think I have ever seen quite this bad a failure of marketing and merchandise planning as this line. If your local store had the good sense to put them over with the Disney Princess and Monster High dolls then Good For Them. They seemingly figured out how to sell them. But that would not appear to be an order that came from Hasbro product management. That was likely somebody local with an ounce of common sense. What makes it worse is we see the exact same mistake comitted with the Marvel "Fan Girl" dolls by Hasbro management. Mattel managed to pull off an upset with their DC Super Hero Girls dolls by putting them in front of girls where they can be bought. Hasbro keeps ignoring common sense rules of how shoppers actually behave.
                              Or it was someone in the southeast at your stores without a lick of sense to put them with the girls toys, because pretty much everyone but TRU (and anything and everything about TRU's business strategy should be in question because they are closing their doors) around here, and back home in New England where my mom lives, had them with the girls toys. And they moved moderately well in those places. So my anecdotal evidence counters your anecdotal evidence and neither of us really knows what recommendations Hasbro made in how to display them or which strategy was the norm over a larger area.

                              -M
                              "Opinion is the lowest form of human knowledge. It requires no accountability, no understanding." -Plato

                              Comment

                              • patches
                                New Member
                                • Jan 12, 2015
                                • 19

                                #75
                                Originally posted by MRP
                                Or it was someone in the southeast at your stores without a lick of sense to put them with the girls toys, because pretty much everyone but TRU (and anything and everything about TRU's business strategy should be in question because they are closing their doors) around here, and back home in New England where my mom lives, had them with the girls toys. And they moved moderately well in those places. So my anecdotal evidence counters your anecdotal evidence and neither of us really knows what recommendations Hasbro made in how to display them or which strategy was the norm over a larger area.

                                -M
                                I can't speak with National. But I do speak with one of the regional ToysRus Product Managers out of the McDonough center. She told me that for that sort of thing shelf positioning is determined by Hasbro and the IP holder. Although she had seen some merchants finally quietly say heck no and put the stuff where it will sell. Hasbro or the similar merchant effectively owns or leases those shelves, not the stores. They are not supposed to get creative (unless of course it works. Then it was the plan all along.) But we are getting too far into the weeds here. I'm happy that somewhere somehow some manager with common sense managed to put the toys in the hands of an appreciative audience. It just seems that most from the national and regional levels did not. It's not just anecdotal, Hasbro released their shareholders report last month. It mentioned a few of the lines, and the ups and downs. Looking at the detail sheets FoD looks to have done fairly poorly. With almost no re-orders from merchants. It's also where you see the pattern of TLJ selling much worse than TFA or Rogue One. (That one was a failure of art design. There was nothing in the movie that was particularly "toyetic". The space ships all looked like half finished trash heaps. The characters all felt like half finished trash heaps.)

                                The one other, I hesitate to call it odd, thing about the FoD dolls is which sold well? Sabine Wren, the badass Mandalorian purple haired chick in full painted up Battle Armor. She was certainly the coolest looking of the dolls. But she was probably the least well known of the characters to the female fans target audience. Yet she is the hardest to find as TRU blows them all out on clearance.

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