Drop the Retro Tag Already, Thoughts?

[Random Axe]

Mattel probably only signed off on the deal with a concept directly aimed at nostalgia, which is why they may not have given it a whole lot of attention. By slapping a retro tag on the product, they immediately identified their target consumer and also pigeonholed their future. They had to know from day one that there was a limited consumer base for this, hence the half-assed packaging and distribution. The word retro means to go backwards.

Had they chosen instead to create a new "Progressive" market of 8-inch clothed figures with the bodies and articulation of DCU Classics and went with iconic, heroic sculpts, this line would still be going. I have no doubts of that. They had the bodies already made in 6-inch scale they could have blown up and had the freakin Four Horsemen on the payroll. All of EMCE's visions and ideas could have been fully realized had they jumped into this with the goals of creating a new market, not to re-kindle a 25 year old one.

ZICA proved, without any measure of doubt, exactly what can be accomplished in this scale. The lisence he chose didn't work out as planned, but how can anyone look at those figures and not be amazed at not only the level of detail of the figures, but also to the respect paid to the legacy Mego left us. I don't see Cheverolet going back and digging out the blueprints to the 1974 Vega anytime soon.

Bottom line here is all of the pieces were in place to create a new, exciting market, they were just never assembled correctly. EMCE did a badass job working within the constraints they were given and I applaud those efforts. Unfortunately, this line became a victim to the corporate monster.

[Jerry68]

Mattel probably only signed off on the deal with a concept directly aimed at nostalgia, which is why they may not have given it a whole lot of attention. By slapping a retro tag on the product, they immediately identified their target consumer and also pigeonholed their future. They had to know from day one that there was a limited consumer base for this, hence the half-assed packaging and distribution. The word retro means to go backwards.

Had they chosen instead to create a new "Progressive" market of 8-inch clothed figures with the bodies and articulation of DCU Classics and went with iconic, heroic sculpts, this line would still be going. I have no doubts of that. They had the bodies already made in 6-inch scale they could have blown up and had the freakin Four Horsemen on the payroll. All of EMCE's visions and ideas could have been fully realized had they jumped into this with the goals of creating a new market, not to re-kindle a 25 year old one.


ZICA proved, without any measure of doubt, exactly what can be accomplished in this scale. The lisence he chose didn't work out as planned, but how can anyone look at those figures and not be amazed at not only the level of detail of the figures, but also to the respect paid to the legacy Mego left us. I don't see Cheverolet going back and digging out the blueprints to the 1974 Vega anytime soon.

Bottom line here is all of the pieces were in place to create a new, exciting market, they were just never assembled correctly. EMCE did a badass job working within the constraints they were given and I applaud those efforts. Unfortunately, this line became a victim to the corporate monster.

Very well written and I agree!

[samurainoir]

It's really unfortunate that Zica had such a high quality project, but not the distribution or marketing muscle. Which is exactly what the DST machine has now that it officially owns the Buck Rogers line. I'm finding myself leaning forward to see what happens next. Particularly with a property that balances out contemporary and retro so well... The Expendables is a modern action movie with the dirty dozen of the eighties. Iconic action stars of yester-year like Stallone et al with sculpts and uniforms that can reflect an action figure produced in the second decade of this millennium. They really need to have the tattoos on Stallone, like BBP did with Anthrax and their Beastly prototype.

The real unfortunate aspect of those like us who are most likely to get on the Retro train, are in fact the smallest demographic population you can possibly market to, sitting firmly between two larger generational demographics... The Boomers and their offspring Boomer Echoes. You just won't find the same kind of numbers nostalgic for Mego that were clamoring for the return of 12" GI Joe a decade or so prior... Those were firmly within the Baby Boom generation. And there are a ridiculous amount of them.

Just casually observing what's going on a generation below us right now, their retro properties like GI Joe RAH, Masters of the Universe, Transformers, Thundercats etc did not come back in the same format as the originals... They all came back with contemporary sculpts and articulation. Which creates a new generation of kids in the toy aisles that will pick up the eighties brands . Of course having big budget movies and animated series helps... But Retro had the DC superheroes!

[Jerry68]

It's really unfortunate that Zica had such a high quality project, but not the distribution or marketing muscle. Which is exactly what the DST machine has now that it officially owns the Buck Rogers line. I'm finding myself leaning forward to see what happens next.

The real unfortunate aspect of those like us who are most likely to get on the Retro train, are in fact the smallest demographic population you can possibly market to, sitting firmly between two larger generational demographics... The Boomers and their offspring Boomer Echoes. You just won't find the same kind of numbers nostalgic for Mego that were clamoring for the return of 12" GI Joe a decade or so prior... Those were firmly within the Baby Boom generation. And there are a ridiculous amount of them.

Just casually observing what's going on a generation below us right now, their retro properties like GI Joe RAH, Masters of the Universe, Transformers, Thundercats etc did not come back in the same format as the originals... They all came back with contemporary sculpts and articulation. Which creates a new generation of kids in the toy aisles that will pick up the eighties brands . Of course having big budget movies and animated series helps... But Retro had the DC superheroes!

This is what has to happen to attract kids to 1/9.

[MIB41]

EMCE put out the Mego Star Trek line exactly as it appeared in the 70's including similar packaging and artwork. And that line lasted a long time. Much longer than Retro Action. I can't believe that line would have failed had they added the word "Retro" to the packaging. Your eyes can assess the obvious by looking at the figure and packaging without the need for a word prompt. Like most things, I think it really comes down to the product. Had Mattel used Paul's Mego bodies, the line would not have suffered quality issues that became the bane of every collector who purchased them. And Mego's influence is being felt on every eight inch figure that has been released. So the nostalgia of this very scale is unavoidable. Ultimately the retro action line was axed from a nameless executive within Mattel who didn't like the line. Plus you have to remember the eight inch format does not cater to a particularly big section of the market, since it's roots are based on concepts only 40 somethings can relate to. The three and six inch market is what the industry builds characters around. And I doubt eight inch figures will ever find that kind of market share unless a line catches fire with the younger generation. Thus far, that has not happened. Most younger kids like painted plastic and can't relate with a figure that has cloth outfits. I think we have a small but solid market with the established companies that have been making this scale. As long as we support those companies, I think we will continue to get more figures from previously untapped licenses.

[samurainoir]

Something else to consider... The main players now in the 12" figure market like Hot Toys and others emerged from the Asian Gray market. Those that are leading the charge essentially made such high quality bootleg figures, that the rest of the world had to sit up and take notice. It's the open source approach.

The biggest customizing talents in the 1/9th scale are right here on the boards hanging out in the customs sections. Toy companies should really take note of that resource, and if not, then there is a Potential DIY vacuum to be filled in terms of who steps up to lead the way for the evolution of this hobby scale.

[CrimsonGhost]

I am curious about ZICA. It keeps being brought up how their figures were examples of forward thinking and modern usage of detail, however they were not successful. So where was the problem? Was it the price or was the license weak or was it distribution? Or a combination of all 3? I mean, I didn't buy one as I'm not interested in Buck Rogers and I didn't want to pay $30+. So I guess it was 2 out of 3 for me.

[MIB41]

I am curious about ZICA. It keeps being brought up how their figures were examples of forward thinking and modern usage of detail, however they were not successful. So where was the problem? Was it the price or was the license weak or was it distribution? Or a combination of all 3? I mean, I didn't buy one as I'm not interested in Buck Rogers and I didn't want to pay $30+. So I guess it was 2 out of 3 for me.

Good questions CrimsonGhost. Zica is often used as an example of how a 1/9th scale figure can have great detail where most do not. While the line did not find the kind of success we all felt it deserved, I think that didn't negate from the advancement Craig made in how the figures should be presented. Anytime a new line sets a new standard, everyone sits up and takes notice, whether the license is popular or not. With the eight inch market being so competitive with only a handful of companies fighting for market share, I think everybody wants to present their product as a front line design with all the bells and whistles. Companies are always looking for people who possess these skills to enhance their own catalog. And in Craig's example, his efforts did not go unrewarded. His ideas were purchased from another company who saw it's potential and wanted it for their own line. That right there is evidence of how a design can help transform an industry. Craig has certainly proven himself to be a great idea man and is once again advancing the way we think about this scale with yet another line of newly designed bodies. I think the industry has benefited enormously from his contributions. I think that is why you see his name and company pop up in conversations so frequently. He's most definitely ahead of the curve.

[CrimsonGhost]

^^ Interesting. I'm curious to see If Diamond fares any better with the line given their distribution.

[BlackKnight]

Zica wasn't successful because of License Property Choices . Face the Facts. After Us Doll Dorks, and a handful of weirdo Fans, Thats all you got...Nobody gives a damn about Buck Rogers. NOT because of Details and Quality of figures. Make No Mistake. DST Sure dove on buying them figures, Designs and Bodies pretty Quickly. Make something somebody gives a Damn about.

[samurainoir]

I am curious about ZICA. It keeps being brought up how their figures were examples of forward thinking and modern usage of detail, however they were not successful. So where was the problem? Was it the price or was the license weak or was it distribution? Or a combination of all 3? I mean, I didn't buy one as I'm not interested in Buck Rogers and I didn't want to pay $30+. So I guess it was 2 out of 3 for me.

I firmly believe Zica's problem was marketing and distribution. I'm only casually interested in Buck Rogers, but when I actually saw what you got in terms of level of detail for that particular price point, I was sold. I know the conditions were probably ideal at Mego Meet, and folks were inclined to purchase, but my understanding is that many had the same reaction I did (previously on the fence) which is why they sold out of the Buck Rogers figures on hand at MM (and I also understand that word of mouth post MM was pretty strong for BR as well in our microcosm here at the Mego Museum).

It will be interesting to see how Battlestar Galactica does given that it is a very similar nostalgia property to Buck Rogers... the difference being BBP has the muscle of one of the largest e-tailers, Entertainment Earth behind it.

I'm very curious to see what DST does now that they have BR.

[The Bat]

I think the "retro" title definitely needs to be dropped. As much as we like the product from old TV shows & movies, it's not going to bring in the kids.

I do think the 8" format could appeal to kids if it's done right. I know when I was a kid I LOVED the size of the 8" scale Megos! I loved that they had removable clothes & accessories. I think you just need the right idea. I think of a line of G.I. Joe style Military & Adventure Figures like a Scuba Diver(figure included, not just a suit)accessories, tanks, fins, mask, etc...and a Shark or an Octopus, in a REALLY COOL package that would not only catch the eye of children...but the older collectors of vintage G.I.Joe figures as well.

Soon I plan on starting a project to illustrate my point, with a little help from my friends(I'm gonna need a really well designed box...and I know just the guy to do it).

[tllgn]

its either new coke or classic coke ,whatever you call them ,their mego style,all are useally under that banner,retro -mego when you search on ebay ,it tells you their not the classic stuff ,i like the term .theres nothing wrong with it ,its direct and to the point .when you say mego ,most folks here think classic ,when you say retro -you mean mego the next generation which includes (emce,bif bang pow ,cttv ,zinca,etc) all the "8" styled figures with removable outfits,and are highly articulated .i always will call them retro-megos until someone has a better phrase.

[thunderbolt]

I am curious about ZICA. It keeps being brought up how their figures were examples of forward thinking and modern usage of detail, however they were not successful. So where was the problem? Was it the price or was the license weak or was it distribution? Or a combination of all 3? I mean, I didn't buy one as I'm not interested in Buck Rogers and I didn't want to pay $30+. So I guess it was 2 out of 3 for me.

IMO it was the liscense and distribution. I had zero interest in it since the show has never done anything for me. If it were Buster Crabbe as Buck I would have been all over it.

[The Bat]

IMO it was the liscense and distribution. I had zero interest in it since the show has never done anything for me. If it were Buster Crabbe as Buck I would have been all over it.

Exactly how I feel Joe. Zica had a very high quality product...but no liscense's I had any interest in purchasing. It a shame really.:(