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WalMart To Sell Religious Action Figures

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  • palitoy
    live. laugh. lisa needs braces
    • Jun 16, 2001
    • 59200

    #46
    AW's underlying message is valid, we should never make anyone feel bad about their beliefs and that goes for everyone.

    Let's not denegrate the final sentiment.
    Places to find PlaidStallions online: https://linktr.ee/Plaidstallions

    Buy Toy-Ventures Magazine here:
    http://www.plaidstallions.com/reboot/shop

    Comment

    • Mikey
      Verbose Member
      • Aug 9, 2001
      • 47242

      #47
      This sucks !!!
      A religious arguement --- and I wasn't even involved because I didn't notice this thread till now
      Is it too late to fan the flames a tad ?

      m

      Comment

      • thunderbolt
        Hi Ernie!!!
        • Feb 15, 2004
        • 34211

        #48
        ^^^ Is it ever really too late?
        You must try to generate happiness within yourself. If you aren't happy in one place, chances are you won't be happy anyplace. -Ernie Banks

        Comment

        • ABMAC
          User
          • May 16, 2002
          • 9665

          #49
          There was no argument. Nothing to see here. Move along.

          Comment

          • jemboy2004
            Persistent Member
            • Aug 14, 2005
            • 1703

            #50
            in the spawn comics they deal with stories with some heaven ties ins too.

            For example Angela is a warrior for heaven and comes down to earth to eliminate hells warriors, which are the spawn.

            Ghost Rider was hells/satans rider, I think?

            Both seem to have religious ties ins and see what was being said by Abmac.

            I think the confusion may be that some don't know their stories and don't realize the religious ties ins Or don't accept them. I'm not saying they represent the beliefs well but they play on them in a very vague way in the stories.

            Comment

            • JDeRouen
              Author of Small Things
              • Jun 14, 2001
              • 16560

              #51
              I, too, have come to this thread late, but, honestly, Anthony didn't seem to be attacking anyone. Hell IS a Christian concept; that's all he was saying. Moreover, he is correct.

              As for the action figures, they're fairly lame. I can't imagine these will be big sellers.
              --
              Order Small Things, my contemporary fantasy novel featuring Megos, at http://joederouen.com/?page_id=176

              Comment

              • aquatroy
                Permanent Member
                • Apr 28, 2002
                • 3289

                #52
                "I haven't been sarcastic, and I haven't attacked your beliefs, yet you seem determined to attack my lack of belief. OK, even though I never said otherwise, I "concede" that failure to believe doesn't prove anything (if that's the point you're trying to make). Now can you go back and reread what's actually in my posts instead of making blind assumptions?"
                Let's do that.


                "No religion = no Hell. Is that simple enough for you?"
                Perhaps. It reads a bit like the "tree falling in the woods" line of logic. The difference being that one can find evidence that a tree did fall. Some claim evidence of hell, but how does one substantiate it?
                The implication that AW is simple is a bit rude.

                "Secularism/Atheism teaches right and wrong based on cultural and personal mores which may or may not parallel those of religious teachings. The faith-based concepts of God, Heaven, Hell, angels, prophets, sin, etc., are rejected. Do you understand that? Satan is a religious concept that's rejected by atheists. Atheists don't believe in him."
                Thanks for the explaination. I don't buy the situational ethics argument. Using the discribed line of thought, canabalism, human sacrifice, slavery, and a host of other autrocities can be explained away as, "Well, that's just what they believe". I realize that those of us that believe in absolutes don't do good job living it, but I would rather aim high and miss. Again, chiding AW wasn't necessary.

                "Like I said, you don't even make any sense in the context of what I was saying. Methinks you joust at windmills."
                I have to admit. I like this one.

                I apologize for my lack of sufficient craftiness. I'll attempt to conceal my underlying tone of ridicule better next time.
                Your plenty crafty. Crafty is good. Crafty is fun. It's just that your rude, too.

                I understand that you feel threatened by me because I don't share your beliefs, and that you let your prejudice blind you so thoroughly that you perceived my correction of your factual error as an attack on your beliefs. I will not accept responsibility for your misperceptions.
                Beams and splinters, dude.

                In the end AW should not have allowed the "simple enough" jab suck him into a pi$$ing match with Abmac. He seems to keep a full bladder at all times. As to the question of who's right. We'll all know that soon enough. If Abmac is right then we all have ... nothing to look forward to. If AW is right then I'll trust a loving Father in Heaven to judge the sheep from the goats.

                BTW, if I want a religious action figure, I'll make one.
                Last edited by aquatroy; Oct 29, '07, 7:41 PM.
                Hey! Check out the pictures.

                Comment

                • ABMAC
                  User
                  • May 16, 2002
                  • 9665

                  #53
                  Originally posted by aquatroy
                  Perhaps. It reads a bit like the "tree falling in the woods" line of logic. The difference being that one can find evidence that a tree did fall. Some claim evidence of hell, but how does one substantiate it?
                  The implication that AW is simple is a bit rude.
                  It apparently wasn't simple enough for him, as he continued to rant for two more weeks about things I never said.

                  If religion had never been invented, the concept of Hell wouldn't exist. That was my entire assertion, nothing more. Your beliefs are none of my concern.

                  Thanks for the explaination. I don't buy the situational ethics argument. Using the discribed line of thought, canabalism, human sacrifice, slavery, and a host of other autrocities can be explained away as, "Well, that's just what they believe". I realize that those of us that believe in absolutes don't do good job living it, but I would rather aim high and miss. Again, chiding AW wasn't necessary.
                  Again, your beliefs – religious, ethical, or otherwise – don't concern me. This was never an argument about beliefs.

                  Your plenty crafty. Crafty is good. Crafty is fun. It's just that your rude, too.
                  I tend to get rude when self-righteous zealots manufacture arguments where none previously existed. I'm funny that way.

                  Beams and splinters, dude.
                  No, just facts and opinions. Apples and oranges. There was no religious debate here.

                  In the end AW should not have allowed the "simple enough" jab suck him into a pi$$ing match with Abmac. He seems to keep a full bladder at all times.
                  This was a non-argument, so please stop thinking about my bladder. I can hold my own, thank you.

                  Comment

                  • Adam West
                    Museum CPA
                    • Apr 14, 2003
                    • 6822

                    #54
                    Originally posted by ABMAC
                    If religion had never been invented, the concept of Hell wouldn't exist. That was my entire assertion, nothing more. Your beliefs are none of my concern.
                    If religion had never been invented....

                    I rest my case.
                    Last edited by ABMAC; Oct 30, '07, 10:27 AM.
                    "The farther we go, the more the ultimate explanation recedes from us, and all we have left is faith."
                    ~Vaclav Hlavaty

                    Comment

                    • Mikey
                      Verbose Member
                      • Aug 9, 2001
                      • 47242

                      #55
                      Adam,
                      If I were you i'd back off and not try to get in the last word -- because it's not going to happen
                      Trust me, the thread will get locked up and you'll get a spanking PM from the mod well before that happens

                      m

                      Comment

                      • JDeRouen
                        Author of Small Things
                        • Jun 14, 2001
                        • 16560

                        #56
                        Originally posted by Adam West
                        Originally posted by ABMAC
                        If religion had never been invented, the concept of Hell wouldn't exist. That was my entire assertion, nothing more. Your beliefs are none of my concern.
                        If religion had never been invented....

                        I rest my case.
                        How so? Not to open up a can of worms, but I honestly don't get your point.
                        Last edited by ABMAC; Oct 30, '07, 10:28 AM.
                        --
                        Order Small Things, my contemporary fantasy novel featuring Megos, at http://joederouen.com/?page_id=176

                        Comment

                        • aquatroy
                          Permanent Member
                          • Apr 28, 2002
                          • 3289

                          #57
                          I don't want to put words in AW's mouth, but I think he's balking at the notion of religion being created. Perhaps, if this conversation is going to continue, it would be good for AW to give us his ideas on religion so that we're all talking about the same thing.

                          For me, the definition of religion is very simple.

                          "Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world."

                          Organized religion would then be a group of believers coming together to pool thier resources so that they can do the most good. To encourage and hold one another accountable.

                          Religion goes wrong when it becomes bogged down in tradition & legalism. This is when religion looses it's heart and becomes and agent of control rather then support.
                          Hey! Check out the pictures.

                          Comment

                          • Adam West
                            Museum CPA
                            • Apr 14, 2003
                            • 6822

                            #58
                            [QUOTE=JDeRouen;55673][quote=Adam West;55662]
                            Originally posted by ABMAC
                            If religion had never been invented, the concept of Hell wouldn't exist. That was my entire assertion, nothing more. Your beliefs are none of my concern.
                            How so? Not to open up a can of worms, but I honestly don't get your point.
                            in·ven·tion /ɪnˈvɛnʃən/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[in-ven-shuhn] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
                            –noun 1. the act of inventing.
                            2. U.S. Patent Law. a new, useful process, machine, improvement, etc., that did not exist previously and that is recognized as the product of some unique intuition or genius, as distinguished from ordinary mechanical skill or craftsmanship.
                            3. anything invented or devised.
                            4. the power or faculty of inventing, devising, or originating.
                            5. an act or instance of creating or producing by exercise of the imagination, esp. in art, music, etc.
                            6. something fabricated, as a false statement.
                            7. Sociology. the creation of a new culture trait, pattern, etc.
                            8. Music. a short piece, contrapuntal in nature, generally based on one subject.
                            9. Rhetoric. (traditionally) one of the five steps in speech preparation, the process of choosing ideas appropriate to the subject, audience, and occasion.
                            10. Archaic. the act of finding.

                            re·li·gion /rɪˈlɪdʒən/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[ri-lij-uhn] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
                            –noun 1. a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.
                            2. a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects: the Christian religion; the Buddhist religion.
                            3. the body of persons adhering to a particular set of beliefs and practices: a world council of religions.
                            4. the life or state of a monk, nun, etc.: to enter religion.
                            5. the practice of religious beliefs; ritual observance of faith.
                            6. something one believes in and follows devotedly; a point or matter of ethics or conscience: to make a religion of fighting prejudice.
                            7. religions, Archaic. religious rites.
                            8. Archaic. strict faithfulness; devotion: a religion to one's vow.
                            —Idiom9. get religion, Informal. a. to acquire a deep conviction of the validity of religious beliefs and practices.
                            b. to resolve to mend one's errant ways: The company got religion and stopped making dangerous products.


                            I understand that Hell, demons, angels, etc. are all religious concepts. What many fail to realize is that there are undertones to the wording that can come across as offensive to those of us that have beliefs whether it be Christian, Judaism, Muslim, etc.

                            Spawn and Ghost Rider are fictional characters. Maybe the intent wasn't there but when a statement is made that Spawn and Ghost Rider are religious figures, to me, it implies that all religious figures are fictional characters.

                            To say No Religon = No Hell to me equates to, "I don't believe in religion, therefore, Hell doesn't exist". Again, maybe that wasn't the intent.

                            And then to say Religion is an Invention by definition says that Religion is something fabricated.

                            Again, maybe the intent isn't there but it certainly comes across that way.

                            If it were one comment, I wouldn't think anything of it but this has been going on for years. I have agreed to address further comments privately as they arise but just want to make others aware that making comments like these can feel as insulting to someone who is a Christian as it is to call something "gay" on these boards and being read by someone who is homosexual.

                            There really is no need to pull the thread in my opinion since I think it is a good, open and honest discussion on different viewpoints and how words can come across as insulting regardless of intent.
                            "The farther we go, the more the ultimate explanation recedes from us, and all we have left is faith."
                            ~Vaclav Hlavaty

                            Comment

                            • ABMAC
                              User
                              • May 16, 2002
                              • 9665

                              #59
                              Originally posted by Adam West
                              religion
                              1. a set of beliefs
                              Beliefs could not have existed before there were people to believe them, therefore someone – God or Man – had to create them.

                              invention
                              Irrelevant, since I didn't say that religion was an "invention."

                              invented
                              1. created or conceived a new thing that previously didn't exist.
                              Again, whether you believe religion was conceived by God or by Man doesn't concern me. The fact is that at one point it didn't exist and now it does. Therefore, it had to have been created.

                              Originally posted by Adam West
                              I understand that Hell, demons, angels, etc. are all religious concepts. What many fail to realize is that there are undertones to the wording that can come across as offensive to those of us that have beliefs whether it be Christian, Judaism, Muslim, etc.
                              "Undertones" are BS. What you mean is that you're offended because you want to be offended.

                              Spawn and Ghost Rider are fictional characters. Maybe the intent wasn't there but when a statement is made that Spawn and Ghost Rider are religious figures, to me, it implies that all religious figures are fictional characters.
                              A logical fallacy. Just because B is a subset of A doesn't mean that all of A is B.

                              To say No Religon = No Hell to me equates to, "I don't believe in religion, therefore, Hell doesn't exist". Again, maybe that wasn't the intent.
                              I've told you repeatedly that I was not supporting or refuting anyone's beliefs, including my own. You obviously don't understand the definition of religion. Religions are belief systems, not the beliefs themselves. You really need to learn what the words mean instead of treating them as buzzwords. Especially if you're going to start arguments over them.

                              And then to say Religion is an Invention by definition says that Religion is something fabricated.

                              Again, maybe the intent isn't there but it certainly comes across that way.
                              You took the sixth definition of a word that I didn't use. You went out of your way to be offended.

                              If it were one comment, I wouldn't think anything of it but this has been going on for years. I have agreed to address further comments privately as they arise but just want to make others aware that making comments like these can feel as insulting to someone who is a Christian as it is to call something "gay" on these boards and being read by someone who is homosexual.
                              What? You've been intentionally misinterpreting my words for years in order to fuel your self-righteous indignation? Again, I'm not responsible for your misperceptions.

                              There really is no need to pull the thread in my opinion since I think it is a good, open and honest discussion on different viewpoints and how words can come across as insulting regardless of intent.
                              Spouting your beliefs in response to your own intentional misreading of my statements is not a "good, open and honest discussion" that needs to continue. I can't stop you from being insulted by my comments as long as you twist them into jabs so that you can martyr yourself upon them, but I can prevent you from wasting my time any further.

                              Comment

                              • palitoy
                                live. laugh. lisa needs braces
                                • Jun 16, 2001
                                • 59200

                                #60
                                This conversation is over.
                                Places to find PlaidStallions online: https://linktr.ee/Plaidstallions

                                Buy Toy-Ventures Magazine here:
                                http://www.plaidstallions.com/reboot/shop

                                Comment

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