Questions About The Batman Series and The Comic

[cdhall]

Thanks ToyRoom for that excellent, detailed response.

And to the others as well.

[Earth 2 Chris]

Are we so sure this is not people re-remembering history as they tell it? I just question the timing of all this....if Babs Gordon/Batgirl debuted on the stands in November of '66 (with a January '67 cover date), then the lead time would have been at least September of '66 when the issue was put to bed more than likely and even further out when the concept was created and Dozier supposedly asked for the character due to slipping ratings. Which I find highly unlikely considering the 1st season of Batman ran from January '66 'til May '66 and the ratings were HUGE! The rating didn't start slipping until Season Two was well underway, at which point Barbara Gordon had already been created and debuted in the comics.

And if she was created with Dozier's request in mind, why did her TV counterpart debut almost a year after the request? Considering she was introduced in one half-hour episode, she could have easily been introduced toward the end of the failing Season 2 as an incentive boost for viewers going in to Season 3.

It could be false memories, but every Bat-book I've read says Dozier asked for a new Batgirl. Some claim he even asked for her to be Gordon's daughter. The most recent book that carries this notion forth is TwoMorrow's Batcave Companion. Schwartz and especially Infantino have been known to tell different versions of character origins over the years, but what I've read of Batgirl's has been pretty consistent.

The time lag could be the usual "hurry up and wait" mentality of Hollywood. Dozier asked for Schwartz to come up with a new Batgirl, he did it, and then Dozier sat on it for a while. Remember DC shelved plans for Lois and Clark's wedding due to the TV series, and had them on hold much longer than anticipated, because the show kept pushing the nuptials back.



Chris

[The Toyroom]

The way I've always understood it is Barbara Gordon/Batgirl was already in development by Julius Schwartz and Carmine Infantino as part of their revival...they had brought back Catwoman, introduced Poison Ivy and Batgirl was the next progression in amping up the female element.

William Dozier saw some of Infantino's concept work for the character and optioned her for the third season in hopes of selling the network on the idea of continuing the series even though ratings had slipped in the Second Season.

Now maybe that's the part where Hollywood works slow, but I still find it strange that a comic book character the debuted pretty much simultaneously with the 2nd Season was created specifically for the hopes of selling the 3rd Season to ABC based on the fact that the 2nd Season ratings were slumping when the 2nd Season hadn't even really begun when Babs debuted....the logic and the time-frame just don't add up.

Unfortunately Schwartz and Dozier have both passed away...Infantino seems to like to give himself more credit than others at times.....So we'll probably never get a clear-cut answer.

I think in all likelihood, Schwartz and Infantino DID create Babs/Batgirl on their own and Dozier decided to option the character for the 3rd Season LATER on, after the fact. Of course, when Dozier told his story, it sounded cooler because Batgirl was the only real hit of the last season, so why not take the credit for it, since she had longevity outside of the TV series.

[johnnystorm]

Here's everything you need to know about the tv series:


DIAL B for BLOG - THE WORLD'S GREATEST COMIC BLOGAZINE

[Wee67]

Thanks to all, and especially Anthony. When I asked, I knew you'd be the guy to give a lot of the info.

One other question about the book almost being cancelled- Was it just the Batman title that was in danger, or were comic books in general in a bad place as the series began? And another question as I think of it- Did the entire comic book industry get a bump from the series? I'd imagine even Marvel was helped by Batman's popularity.

[Wee67]

Here's everything you need to know about the tv series:


DIAL B for BLOG - THE WORLD'S GREATEST COMIC BLOGAZINE

Wow, this is a really great read! This is one of my all-time favorite shows so I appreciate the insight.

[The Toyroom]

One other question about the book almost being cancelled- Was it just the Batman title that was in danger, or were comic books in general in a bad place as the series began? And another question as I think of it- Did the entire comic book industry get a bump from the series? I'd imagine even Marvel was helped by Batman's popularity.

From all accounts, it was the Batman titles, "Batman" and presumably "Detective Comics" that were on the chopping block, prior to the "New Look" experiment that preceeded the TV show by 2 years. If anything, the "New Look" saved Batman from cancellation and the advent of the TV show just gave it the extra boost to maintain that momentum.

DC Comics definitely saw a bump other than just the Batman titles....an excellent example is the "Justice League of America" title...Batman was featured VERY prominently on several covers in succession during the Batmania period and often dwarfed his fellow JLAers in size. Many of the covers had that "campy"element as well.

Marvel and other companies all cashed in on that Camp Craze during the Batmani period in different ways but DC was probably the most successful.

[cdhall]

Here's everything you need to know about the tv series:


DIAL B for BLOG - THE WORLD'S GREATEST COMIC BLOGAZINE

I'll have to read that later. I got to part 2 but have to get to work.

[generic]

-The Riddler was just a minor and forgettable villain in the comics. This series is responsible for turning him into one of the most popular villains in Batman's rogues gallery.

The Riddler debuted in "Detective Comics" #140 (Oct. '48) and made his 2nd appearance in Dec. '48. After that he enjoyed a long hiatus until his 1st Silver Age appearance in "Batman" #171 (May '65). So, yes, Frank Gorshin's stellar performance is responsible for really putting the Riddler on the map as one of Batman's top 4 foes.

I didn't know that! Wow, you really do learn a lot of stuff around here! By the way, don't forget that John Astin (Gomez from The Addam's Family TV Show) played The Riddler on the 1960s Batman TV show as well!

-After the show was canceled, the character's comic series took on a dark and deadly serious tone that was reminiscent of the original comics in the late 1930s as a reaction to the TV show's light touch.

The Neal Adams era after the show is my absolute favorite Batman era! THAT is what comes to mind when I think of Batman.

I know Batgirl was brought in to pick up ratings, but I was under the impression she was first intended as a spin off companion series. When the pilot wasnt picked up it was decided to drop her into the Batman series?

Yes, I've seen the Batgirl pilot. I'm glad that the show lasted long enough for Batgirl to appear in the 3rd season since the Batgirl TV show didn't pan out. You've gotta love that Batgirl!

DIAL B for BLOG - THE WORLD'S GREATEST COMIC BLOGAZINE

Awesome!

[thunderbolt]

Astin only played the Riddler once, as a fill in for Gorshin.