Who else seen Star Wars in theatre in 1977 ? --- and how many times did you see it ?

[Vortigern99]

I meant impactful for the audience, but in either case I disagree Luke has no "virtually no" reaction. He's visibly shaken for a moment, which is all he has time for given the urgency of his mission.

[Hector]

I saw back in 77 with my dad at the drive-in theater...it was the most awesome experience at the movies ever.

My dad and I liked it so much...that the following week...we saw it at the giant Coronet theater in San Francisco...it was something I will never forget.

Great, great memories, my late father and I...watching Star Wars during its first run...simply out of this world.

[Hector]

Original trilogy...sublime and spiritual.

New trilogy...garbage.

[theressa]

I saw it 5 times in the theater. It was held over for 5 weeks, and I went every weekend
I was 12 at the time.

Funny, I just recently picked up the VHS trilogy in widescreen, with only the THX upgrade. None of the added garbage.
Yes, I'm faithful to the original flix

[darklord1967]

I meant impactful for the audience, but in either case I disagree Luke has no "virtually no" reaction. He's visibly shaken for a moment, which is all he has time for given the urgency of his mission.

I suppose this is (yet again) another example of how we'll have to agree to disagree.

When I said that Biggs' death had virtually no impact, I too meant for the audience... a casual, non hard-core fan audience. They don't really know who Biggs is to Luke personally beyond being his wingman.

The pilot reaction shots footage (without dialogue) that was edited into the Death Star assault in A NEW HOPE was placed more for pace than emotional content.

George Lucas' directorial and editing style simply did not seem to focus on the emotional state of the characters (especially in the heat of battle)... Lucas' tendency was almost always to maintain a fast pace in these battle sequences, and generally reduce things to quick cuts of frantic head turns or flipping of switches.

His directorial mantra is "faster... more intense".

To my eyes there's a LOT of evidence that suggests that there were a lot of silent pilot reaction shots that were filmed (pilots looking left, right, up, adjusting controls, etc.) which had so specific emotional context linked to anything else. They were intended as "filler" reaction shots.

Luke's "reaction" shot immediately after Biggs is vaporized (a glance over his right shoulder, and then a determined facing forward) seems to me to be one of those "filler" shots that Lucas placed in the scene to maintain the pace.

That shot (emotionally, compositionally, and stylistically) is virtually identical to an earlier shot of Luke in that battle as he fires a laser volley that successfully blasts apart one of the Death Star's laser cannon emplacements:

The moment occurs early in the assault. It's immediately after Luke first hears Kenobi's spirit voice say "Luke... trust your feelings". Luke pauses, then fires his weapons. His lasers strike the Death Star's surface. We then cut to the Death Star's interior as Imperial Gunners are thrown back by the explosion of their cannon. Luke's reaction shot then happens. The shot is a silent glance over his left shoulder, and then a facing forward with determination once again.

But Lucas is very clever in his editing. He is able to create the impression of Luke being "visibly shaken" after Biggs' death by editing in one of Luke's slower head turns.

Honestly, Luke appeared far more "visibly shaken" to me in his reaction shot after Red Leader's "kamikaze-like" death.

There was a fear-mixed-with-determination look that Mark Hammil put on his face that was definitely scene-specific.

[darklord1967]

Original trilogy...sublime and spiritual.

New trilogy...garbage.

Correction: New Trilogy... awesome!!

[jds1911a1]

I hated the change they made at the end of Jedi by replacing the Ewok victory dance song at the end.
I liked the original song a lot better.

The new crappy one doesn't even have a beat.

Hate both equally

[jds1911a1]

The changes I like least in the final scenes are the actual dogfight. the technological limits of the 70's gave the shots a ww2 arial gun camera footage feel (as a kid who grew up watching world at war and Victory at sea I loved that) that grittness is lost in the expanded footage

[Gorn Captain]

yes .

Yes!!!!!!!

There are also some interesting scenes, like the Darklighter scenes, shots from Han and his girlfriend in the Cantina. And, to name but one, the scene that was cut, where the Rebels release captured Wampas in the ice caves, so the Snow Troopers run into them, and C3PO exchanging signs on the doors, so the Imperials walk straight in the trap.
This is rough material, but I loved seeing it.

A guy in England made a great DVD-R set, with the three movies, tons of extras, a DVD with all the toy commercials from TV. He made some great covers to the sleeves (vintage SW style), a nice copy of the Holiday Special, all-in-all an eight DVD set. He charged $100 for everything. I watched it all with a friend, great stuff. Now THIS is what we want to see....

[huedell]

Agreed! By and large, I think the Special Edition changes only improved those three films.

But, uh, let me ask you Hud: Do you really mean you love "each and every" addition / change? Really?

First off, I take back what I said.

Actually, I should rephrase and say that nothing BOTHERED ME
or I DIDN'T NOTICE anything I didn't like except the Han/Greedo thing.

I learned alot reading your post and answering it just now.
I also learned a lot from the other posts you and other more
observant fans made in this thread.

I'm the type of STAR WARS fan that basically tries not to gert to rattled
by things---that's because I want to enjoy my cherished STAR WARS rather
than become irritated by it for things I can get by with---at least
that's my guess why I don't notice most of this stuff.

The other excuse is that I'm just bad at noticing things.
The Han/Greedo re-edit? I can't even tell WHO is shooting first anymore

I mean, for example, did you like the addition of Luke and Biggs' re-union at the Rebel Base fighter hangar?

Don't get me wrong. I thought it was a nice enough scene. But I just felt that WITHOUT of the context of the earlier meeting between the two characters at Toshi Station on Tatooine (which they did not include in the film), this later reunion scene just loses its meaning... and it's a bit confusing (to non hard-core STAR WARS fans who do not know who Biggs Darklighter is.

I actually remember some people in the theater back in '97 whispering "Who's that?" when Biggs came over and warmly greeted Luke before boarding his fighter.

This is my favorite new edit aside from the Jabba stuff.
I agree with what I read Vort say.
After reading your post about "edits", you know the movie too well darklord
to avoid certain feelings about some things, I guess.
I'm a big fan of the new Biggs footage.

And how about some of the AUDIO changes to the films? Did you love all of those?

During the lightsaber duel in THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK after Vader cuts Luke's hand cut off and reveals himself as his father, the dark lord tells Luke that he should join him and that "...it is the ONLY way".

Well, I always thought it was cool how Luke gave Vader one final look of defiance, and then let himself fall into the bottomless air shaft toward (what he must have thought was) certain death.

Luke's original SILENT fall spoke volumes about his willingness to make a heroic sacrifice rather than join Vader and his vile Emperor. He actually preferred DEATH, and was willing to embrace it.

In the Special Edition version of Empire, a girly-man scream was actually added to Luke's fall... in my view completely destroying the meaning and impact of the scene.

I agree 100% with you here---problem is I never noticed it to have
a problem with it.

To make matters worse, the scream they added for Luke was actually a re-hash of the Emperor's scream from Return of the Jedi (when he is hurled down the elevator shaft by Vader)! Not good.

Again---I didn't know that---ironic choice though
---Lucas probably thought he was so cool with that choice

NOTE: Evidently, the kind folks at Lucasfilm eventually came to their senses regarding this particular change. When the Original Trilogy films were finally released to DVD back in 2004, they got rid of Luke's girly-man scream, and restored his original silent fall.

Didn't even realize all this had went down. But sounds like
a "happy ending" to this dilemma. Moving on...

A little later in the film, Vader's curt, and menacing "Bring my Shuttle!" is made so much less effective by James Earl Jones' re-dubbing of the replacement line, "Alert my star destroyer to prepare for my arrival".

I had a song with the lyric "She prepares for my arrival" in it.
A friend that knew my lyrics saw this re-edit with me.
She asked if I "stole" that phrase from the movie. I laughed and told
her I didn't and wow, wasn't that an interesting phrase for a SW movie
to have.
(The change from the other line didn't bother me BTW...I had forgotten
it, even in spite of probably hearing it 100 times before).

And then, of course, they added a completely un-necessary shuttle docking scene which only served to interrupt the film's frantic pace and plotting (established with the Millennium Falcon's escape from Cloud City).

Like Lucas had hoped...I relished seeing how Vader got onto the Destroyer.
Score one for Lucas

In RETURN OF THE JEDI The addition of the new Jabba's palace song ("Jedi Rocks") was a welcome one (as far as I was concerned). I loved the song.

I liked the new song too. And Lucas is endearing talking about how
he thought adding a "music video" into a SW movie would be funny.

But I did NOT like the elimination of the original song (Lapti-Nek) which I always thought was brilliantly wild and alien-sounding.

I felt there was somehow room for BOTH songs (through judicious editing).

I kinda miss that song...but not too much...I'll still listen to the
mp3 of it for memories. I would've like both Palace songs too.

Same with the Ewok song. I originally HATED the new song at the end of Jedi
and the removal of the Ewok song---although I can see the reasoning behind
why they did it. Why couldn't they have a little YUB-YUB----C'mon!

Just wondering what you thought of these changes.

Thanks, man...nice to discuss

[huedell]

Agreed! By and large, I think the Special Edition changes only improved those three films.

But, uh, let me ask you Hud: Do you really mean you love "each and every" addition / change? Really?

I mean, for example, did you like the addition of Luke and Biggs' re-union at the Rebel Base fighter hangar?

Don't get me wrong. I thought it was a nice enough scene. But I just felt that WITHOUT of the context of the earlier meeting between the two characters at Toshi Station on Tatooine (which they did not include in the film), this later reunion scene just loses its meaning... and it's a bit confusing (to non hard-core STAR WARS fans who do not know who Biggs Darklighter is.

I actually remember some people in the theater back in '97 whispering "Who's that?" when Biggs came over and warmly greeted Luke before boarding his fighter.

Even though I stand by what I said above about being very pleased with
the whole "Biggs insert" in the SE...I have to clarify...I was kinda miffed about
Bill Clinton's cameo in the scene...I think Lucas was just trying to show off.

[Hector]

Correction: New Trilogy... awesome!!

I apologize for saying that the new trilogy was garbage.

How about putrid sulfuric acid instead?

[VintageMike]

I belive only once in '77, I was six at the time. I seem to remember there being a rerelease in 78. I got to see it again then and they were actually selling the figures in the theatre. My parents bought me an R2-D2 which I still have.

[darklord1967]

Even though I stand by what I said above about being very pleased with
the whole "Biggs insert" in the SE...I have to clarify...I was kinda miffed about
Bill Clinton's cameo in the scene...I think Lucas was just trying to show off.

Good one!!

Say Hud, I'm not sure if you ever noticed an interesting aspect of that hangar re-union scene:

See, originally, when Red Leader stops over and chats with Luke and Biggs the dialogue was much more extensive.

Red Leader originally told Luke about how he knew his father (Anakin). He mentioned that he met him once when he (Red Leader) was just a boy, and that he was a terrific pilot. He encourages Luke that he'll do "... better than alright..." if he has half of his father's piloting skills.

Well, I guess that when Lucas decided to re-insert that scene for the Special Edition, he wanted to save that information about Anakin for the Prequels. (even though Kenobi mentions the same thing earlier in the movie).

Anyhow that chunk of dialogue (in the middle of the scene) was edited out. The trouble was, that entire scene was played out in a single master shot, so making the edit was no easy task without creating a jump cut. There were no close-ups to cut to.

The solution: They filmed a Rebel Technician walking through the shot, and used him as a "digital wipe" to bridge the beginning and tail end dialogue of that scene... while effectively cutting out Red Leader's dialogue in the middle!

There is one bit of telltale evidence to all this: Watch R2-D2 (on the right of the frame) being loaded into Luke's X-Wing. When the digitally inserted "technician" passes through the frame, R2's previous position suddenly jumps.

[darklord1967]

I apologize for saying that the new trilogy was garbage.

How about putrid sulfuric acid instead?

Sigh... What am I gonna do with you Hector?