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Star Trek: Strange New Worlds (Season 2) - Trailer

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  • Earth 2 Chris
    Verbose Member
    • Mar 7, 2004
    • 32498

    #16
    Gene Roddenberry also possibly rewrote every script so he'd get credit and money for it. He created Star Trek, and gave us years of wonderful entertianment, that can't be argued, but the man wasn't a saint. He basically abandonned the show during TOS, after painting a target on it by constantly berating the very network it was on. He was more insterested in rewriting scripts to try and get Shatner, and then Nimoy to hawk his IDIC medallion from Lincoln Enterprises, than to step in and save the quality of the show, despite the actors begging him to.

    So these modern showrunners may have their issues, and the direction they are taking it may not be to your liking, but I don't think not slavishly following established continuity makes them lazy or soulless. And if some fans (including myself) dig some of it, that doesn't make us any less fans than those who demand such strict adherence to continuity. For some, it just isn't as much of a deal breaker.
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    • Liu Bei
      Banned
      • Mar 31, 2018
      • 755

      #17
      Originally posted by Earth 2 Chris
      Gene Roddenberry also possibly rewrote every script so he'd get credit and money for it. He created Star Trek, and gave us years of wonderful entertianment, that can't be argued, but the man wasn't a saint. He basically abandonned the show during TOS, after painting a target on it by constantly berating the very network it was on. He was more insterested in rewriting scripts to try and get Shatner, and then Nimoy to hawk his IDIC medallion from Lincoln Enterprises, than to step in and save the quality of the show, despite the actors begging him to.

      So these modern showrunners may have their issues, and the direction they are taking it may not be to your liking, but I don't think not slavishly following established continuity makes them lazy or soulless. And if some fans (including myself) dig some of it, that doesn't make us any less fans than those who demand such strict adherence to continuity. For some, it just isn't as much of a deal breaker.
      I agree Gene wasn’t a saint, and he certainly was a money grubber, but he didn’t get a writing credit on the overwhelming majority of scripts he rewrote. Herb Solow and Bob Justman’s book (Inside Star Trek) is a very good resource on the work Gene put into the show if you’re interested.

      Gene didn’t abandon the show until season 3, when it was clear the series wasn’t going to get renewed. I’m not defending it, but that’s the way it was, according to people who actually worked on the production side of the series.

      Anyway, Gene Roddenberry’s character isn’t the issue here. It’s lazy writers for soulless billion dollar corporations who admittedly never loved Star Trek and have no understanding of what it was about. And if your primary defense of their bad writing is to trash the creator of the series and badmouth him, it really doesn’t say much for your defense.

      I don’t mind people liking these shows. I remember people hating (and many still hating) Voyager and Enterprise. And it wasn’t a sin. We understood that was just the way it was. There’s just something weird going on nowadays where people get so darn defensive anytime there is criticism of the crappy products being put out by billion dollar corporations.

      So what if my show sucks? Gene Roddenberry sucked too! And how about these other whataboutisms!?!?
      Last edited by Liu Bei; Apr 25, '23, 5:32 PM.

      Comment

      • TRDouble
        Permanent Member
        • Jul 10, 2012
        • 2525

        #18
        It seems like most of the stuff I grew up with -- Star Trek, Disney, Marvel, DC, etc. -- are, or are all run by soulless, billion dollar corporations these days, LOL!

        So, I haven't really watched any of the new Trek TV stuff. Can I watch, without any confusion, "Strange New Worlds" without watching anything else, like "Star Trek: Discovery"?

        Comment

        • Earth 2 Chris
          Verbose Member
          • Mar 7, 2004
          • 32498

          #19
          I agree Gene wasn’t a saint, and he certainly was a money grubber, but he didn’t get a writing credit on the overwhelming majority of scripts he rewrote. Herb Solow and Bob Justman’s book (Inside Star Trek) is a very good resource on the work Gene put into the show if you’re interested.

          Gene didn’t abandon the show until season 3, when it was clear the series wasn’t going to get renewed. I’m not defending it, but that’s the way it was, according to people who actually worked on the production side of the series.

          Anyway, Gene Roddenberry’s character isn’t the issue here. It’s lazy writers for soulless billion dollar corporations who admittedly never loved Star Trek and have no understanding of what it was about. And if your primary defense of their bad writing is to trash the creator of the series and badmouth him, it really doesn’t say much for your defense.

          I don’t mind people liking these shows. I remember people hating (and many still hating) Voyager and Enterprise. And it wasn’t a sin. We understood that was just the way it was. There’s just something weird going on nowadays where people get so darn defensive anytime there is criticism of the crappy products being put out by billion dollar corporations.

          So what if my show sucks? Gene Roddenberry sucked too! And how about these other whataboutisms!?!?
          I recommend Marc Cushman's "These Are the Voyages" series of books. He was given access to Roddenberry's archives and the okay of Roddenberry and Bob Justman to write those books. It's an unbiased, fair examination of the production of the show. It can be argued Roddenberry began abandonning Trek far earlier than Season 3, and he definitely did the show no favors by angering NBC ever chance he got.

          I brought up Gene to make a point. He wasn't perfect, and neither are the new guys. Star Trek has been made by a "souless corporation" ever since Lucy sold Desilu to Paramount during the original run of the series.

          If I was getting defensive, it's because you are constantly on the offense with these new Trek shows. You are well within your right to dislike them and critique them, but I think you can do that without calling the creators names, and repeatedly calling them "bad writers" when Strange New Worlds Season 1 in particular was quite well-received. Obviously a lot of people disagree that they are poorly written.
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          • palitoy
            live. laugh. lisa needs braces
            • Jun 16, 2001
            • 59204

            #20
            This is a public discussion board, and everyone is free to express their opinions, but I think the vitriol and hyperbole are a drag at times. I get it. People don't like the direction of a series; it happens to me too, I dislike a lot of trek. It's just pop culture; we're not at war. Vote by not watching, not buying. It's the most effective form of voting, but I never saw the point of endless complaining. We're here to have fun. I mean this is a break from doing my taxes and I can't wait to dive back into it now.
            Places to find PlaidStallions online: https://linktr.ee/Plaidstallions

            Buy Toy-Ventures Magazine here:
            http://www.plaidstallions.com/reboot/shop

            Comment

            • Liu Bei
              Banned
              • Mar 31, 2018
              • 755

              #21
              Originally posted by Earth 2 Chris
              I recommend Marc Cushman's "These Are the Voyages" series of books. He was given access to Roddenberry's archives and the okay of Roddenberry and Bob Justman to write those books. It's an unbiased, fair examination of the production of the show. It can be argued Roddenberry began abandonning Trek far earlier than Season 3, and he definitely did the show no favors by angering NBC ever chance he got.

              I brought up Gene to make a point. He wasn't perfect, and neither are the new guys.
              My criticism of the people working on the current product is that they are bad writers. It’s not a personal criticism. Your response to a valid criticism (bad writing) is a personal criticism of Gene Roddenberry.

              Star Trek has been made by a "souless corporation" ever since Lucy sold Desilu to Paramount during the original run of the series.

              If I was getting defensive, it's because you are constantly on the offense with these new Trek shows. You are well within your right to dislike them and critique them, but I think you can do that without calling the creators names…
              I didn’t call anybody names. I said they were bad writers who didn’t like the show, didn’t understand the show, and that they routinely violate canon. That’s not name calling. Those are all legitimate points of contention.

              …and repeatedly calling them "bad writers" when Strange New Worlds Season 1 in particular was quite well-received. Obviously a lot of people disagree that they are poorly written.
              I don’t think a series or movie has to be well-written to be well-received.

              That aside, which episodes in particular did you find to be be well-written, and why? And how do you think they compare to the best episodes of season 1 of TOS?

              Comment

              • palitoy
                live. laugh. lisa needs braces
                • Jun 16, 2001
                • 59204

                #22
                Please also name 3 Metallica songs other than Master of Puppets.
                Places to find PlaidStallions online: https://linktr.ee/Plaidstallions

                Buy Toy-Ventures Magazine here:
                http://www.plaidstallions.com/reboot/shop

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                • sprytel
                  Talkative Member
                  • Jun 26, 2009
                  • 6539

                  #23
                  Here is the thing about canon...

                  In STII:TWOK, Khan says that he recognizes Chekov from years ago.
                  Now a pedant may say: "that's a mistake... Chekov and Khan never met."
                  An apologist may say: "clearly, they met off-screen at some point... I can explain it away..."
                  Only an idiot would say... "STII:TWOK is a badly written movie."

                  SNW has made a few decisions that are a challenge to reconcile with known canon. For most of them, there may still be an explanation... I'm willing to take the apologist route on those for now, and see how this all plays out. That faith seems to have been rewarded so far.

                  Comment

                  • Liu Bei
                    Banned
                    • Mar 31, 2018
                    • 755

                    #24
                    Originally posted by sprytel
                    Here is the thing about canon...

                    In STII:TWOK, Khan says that he recognizes Chekov from years ago.
                    Now a pedant may say: "that's a mistake... Chekov and Khan never met."
                    An apologist may say: "clearly, they met off-screen at some point... I can explain it away..."
                    Only an idiot would say... "STII:TWOK is a badly written movie."

                    SNW has made a few decisions that are a challenge to reconcile with known canon. For most of them, there may still be an explanation... I'm willing to take the apologist route on those for now, and see how this all plays out. That faith seems to have been rewarded so far.
                    Canon violations don’t necessarily correlate with bad writing, nor was that argument being made. Bad writing and canon violations were two examples of why I don’t enjoy the show.

                    Comment

                    • Bruce Banner
                      HULK SMASH!
                      • Apr 3, 2010
                      • 4327

                      #25
                      Originally posted by palitoy
                      Please also name 3 Metallica songs other than Master of Puppets.
                      Easy! There are only four Metallica albums, after all.

                      PUNY HUMANS!

                      Comment

                      • PB
                        Member
                        • Jul 2, 2021
                        • 92

                        #26
                        The trailer felt off to me, maybe it was the music that didn’t seem to jive and the modern dialogue. I miss the professionalism of being in Starfleet, duty and procedure. Now everyone is basically hanging out together all of the time. Teamwork has always been part of any crews success but the writing always comes back to emphasizing sappy togetherness. It should go without saying they are all in it together. It used to be the stories revolves around meaningful thought provoking challenges, but now it’s “I got this” and “Hyeeee.” I don’t need everything serious but at least the Klingons are looking ok drinking blood wine.

                        I’d like to see the writers and producers pass a basic Star Trek trivia test before they are allowed to write a script.

                        I hate revolving doors too but Kirk isn’t from space he’s from Iowa.

                        Comment

                        • Liu Bei
                          Banned
                          • Mar 31, 2018
                          • 755

                          #27
                          Originally posted by PB
                          The trailer felt off to me, maybe it was the music that didn’t seem to jive and the modern dialogue. I miss the professionalism of being in Starfleet, duty and procedure. Now everyone is basically hanging out together all of the time. Teamwork has always been part of any crews success but the writing always comes back to emphasizing sappy togetherness. It should go without saying they are all in it together. It used to be the stories revolves around meaningful thought provoking challenges, but now it’s “I got this” and “Hyeeee.” I don’t need everything serious but at least the Klingons are looking ok drinking blood wine.

                          I’d like to see the writers and producers pass a basic Star Trek trivia test before they are allowed to write a script.

                          I hate revolving doors too but Kirk isn’t from space he’s from Iowa.
                          The lack of professionalism is something I’ve mentioned before. Seeing characters cuss, use drugs, disrespect commanding officers and disobey direct orders is not Star Trek.

                          Comment

                          • TrekStar
                            Trek or Treat
                            • Jan 20, 2011
                            • 8355

                            #28
                            I watched season one going in with an open mind, and it was a little better than I thought giving it a 7 out of 10

                            It was though a bit confusing, since I didn’t know both Lt. Uhura and Nurse Chapel both served with Captain Pike along with Dr. M’Benga and that Andorians served in starfleet.

                            I guess Dr. M’Benga made sense since he was a doctor and familiar with Vulcan biology, but as mentioned above, seeing characters use bad language and disobedience along with Spock involved in two different affairs just kind of makes me shake my head, although Nurse Chapel does look pretty good in that tight white bodysuit.

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                            • Hector
                              el Hombre de Acero
                              • May 19, 2003
                              • 31852

                              #29
                              My babe is La'an Noonien-Singh…
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                              • KnightDetective
                                Veteran Member
                                • Aug 31, 2012
                                • 257

                                #30
                                I've fairly enjoyed what I've seen of Strange New Worlds so far. No idea why they insist it is the Prime timeline though.

                                I cope by considering TOS, TAS, TNG, DS9 and Voyager as classic and untouchable. No retconning necessary.

                                For current streaming Trek, I brush all the inconsistencies aside into a self-contained little pile by considering the TNG movies (and all of their differences from the tv series) as alternate timeline. For me, TNG First Contact creates the current timeline, where I place ST Enterprise as the result, which leads to ST Discovery, Strange New Worlds and ST Picard's grimdark version of TNG. This lets me enjoy SNW at least without worrying about all of the changes in style and behavior. I figure all of the cussin', loose morals and strange lack of adequate lighting technology place it halfway between the Prime and Mirror Universes.

                                Must say the frequently informal tone is a little jarring. The SNW episodes I saw sometimes felt like a house of hip twenty-something gamers or students, with Pike as the cool house parent. If the writers are attempting to reference the relaxed camaraderie of the TOS crew in their later years, well, these fresh young whippersnappers haven't earned that yet. I don't know, maybe this version of Starfleet is run by really mellow college age kids...

                                (One more thing, forget the rumored Section 31 show/movie. I'd watch the daylights out of a retcon show where Michelle Yeoh had tossed Teary von Mutiny-Britches directly out of the nearest airlock and went on with the adventures of the Shenzhou! But that's just me. I kept trying Discovery, just wasn't my cuppa. Everyone else enjoy, though!)

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