Mine Was Wonder Woman. My Friend's Was Robin.

[Wee67]

One of the Robins just came out of the closet
Tim Drake is finding himself, and going on a date with a boy

https://www.polygon.com/comics/22617395/robin-gay-queer-batman-dc-comics

I remember years ago having a conversation with a friend where I told him one of my earliest moments of sexual consciousness was the weird feelings I had for Lynda Carter's Wonder Woman. He was a bit older and told me his was watching Burt Ward's Robin. Admittedly, it slightly shook the way I looked at Batman and Robin, but it was good to see something from another person's perspective. It forced me to confront my own homophobia, however slight it may have been.

It also made me wonder, with about 5% of the US population identifying as LGBT (combined with whatever percentage was still closeted), why weren't there any openly gay superheroes (this was pre-Northstar). You had Extraño, but he was about as open as Uncle Arthur on Bewitched or Monroe on Too Close For Comfort.

I wonder how much easier the already-difficult transition of puberty would have been for him others if Tim Drake existed decades ago.

[Dark Shadow]

^Burt Ward's Robin was my early childhood fascination. Several years on, in reruns, it became something more.

Not sure about the motivation behind these modern "coming outs", they feel disingenuous and manipulative to me, I hope I'm wrong.

Of course, without doubt, it would have been great back in the day to have been validated via the media (if nowhere else) when parents, family, neighbors, teachers, preachers etc. were all so condemning. Today's youth have real world role models to look up to, plus a healthy amount of media validation. If this helps anyone who is struggling, then it's a definitely a win, regardless. However, if it's just about grabbing a market niche...

[Wee67]

Not sure about the motivation behind these modern "coming outs", they feel disingenuous and manipulative to me, I hope I'm wrong.

Yeah, they do seem to be exploitive, at times. That said, I think the good outweighs the bad, even if it just a case of virtue signaling.

I did get a kick out of Batwoman being gay, given that she was first introduced to prove that Batman wasn't.

[palitoy]

Everyone needs representation although I get the idea that this may be manipulative agenda to get sales. I hope it's handled well.

Also, as a warning to anyone posting a "PC agenda" rant. Please remember many of us have LGBTQ+ family, children, and friends. I love several members of this community with all my heart. Let's keep it civil, please.

[monitor_ep]

I grew up in the 70's were Robin were those short-shorts. I read a lot of Batman & Robin but started to collect more Robin merchandise without knowing why.

From Elementary though the 7th grade I never showed interest in girls. Where I grew up I did not know about liking guys. All I ever saw or heard about was boy-girl relations. It wasn't until I was in the 8th grade where I meet my first bestfriend & soon boyfriend. We were the only 8th graders in 1st period gym class so Coach let us fold that days towels, We were in a closet bumping into each other and one thing led to another we began kissing. We stayed together through High School. It was when he spent to night at my house that he gave me a smirk and said now he knows why I like boys, with all these Robin items its basically a boy in green underwear. We laughed and made my night when he put on my Robin Underroos.

So yes Robin does mean something to me that I will always thank DC Comics for.

[Earth 2 Chris]

As a stuffy old straight guy, I kind of scoff at what seems to be semi-random "assignments" to potentially grab headlines, because they almost always go against previously established character traits. Tim has had quite a few romances, all girls, Stephanie (Spoiler/Robin/Batgirl) Brown being the primary one. Having said all that, there are plenty of characters who match my preferences (like 90 plus % of them). I would prefer creators create their own characters and not bend existing characters to their needs, but I also understand it means more to people to have an established hero represent something you can relate to.

Chris

[monitor_ep]

The thing with Tim Drake/Robin is he was was leaning towar5d bi for years but DC Comics wouldn't let the writers came out and say it. Tim has always had a HUGE crush on Conner Kent/Superboy. Yes it started out as his bestfriend but once he was gone it hit him harder than it should have. Tim tried to clone him because he missed him. I have talked to the writers and they keep getting shut down on the Robin/Superboy romance. So the fact that DC is now letting Tim date a boy is a course correction.

Now saying this I would have pegged Damion Wayne/Jon Kent as the first gay couple in there families. They were young and always together and then the Bizarro bersion of Robin proved it when he would kiss Superboy openly. This cold be the reason why they shuttled of Superboy to an other Superboy to avoid this.

[Earth 2 Chris]

The thing with Tim Drake/Robin is he was was leaning towar5d bi for years but DC Comics wouldn't let the writers came out and say it. Tim has always had a HUGE crush on Conner Kent/Superboy. Yes it started out as his bestfriend but once he was gone it hit him harder than it should have. Tim tried to clone him because he missed him. I have talked to the writers and they keep getting shut down on the Robin/Superboy romance. So the fact that DC is now letting Tim date a boy is a course correction.

I should have mentioned that Tim's obsession over Connor could have been read as romantic. I do think males can have strong feelings for each other without any kind of romantic/sexual component but that aspect of Tim's character can certainly be seen as a roadmap to where he's being taken now.

Chris

[Wee67]

Everyone needs representation although I get the idea that this may be manipulative agenda to get sales. I hope it's handled well.

Also, as a warning to anyone posting a "PC agenda" rant. Please remember many of us have LGBTQ+ family, children, and friends. I love several members of this community with all my heart. Let's keep it civil, please.

Thanks, Brian. I was reluctant to post this for fear of just that. I was honestly wondering about the hypothetical effects of this happening decades ago. My nephew came out 3 years ago at 17, living in a very small town in Northern Idaho. I was amazed to see how things were so much easier for him (still challenging, but easier than when I was a teen). He seemed almost disappointed. He reminded me of the only gay in the village from Little Britain!

Not sure about the motivation behind these modern "coming outs", they feel disingenuous and manipulative to me, I hope I'm wrong.

Agreed. The danger of these things NOT being handled well is that they can ultimately become counterproductive. I do agree, Drake's reaction to Conner's death may have been Drake beginning to question his own sexuality. Some people do come to terms later in life. A friend once explained why she couldn't find the right guy for her because, after 15 years of dating, she realized the best guy for her was a girl

[Werewolf]

I'm not really super knowledgeable with Batman lore anymore but isn't there's like a bajillion Robins now? So, I don't really see the harm if it's done non-exploitatively and fits the character. From what Monitor_ep is saying it doesn't sound like the change is out of line with the character.

And hopefully it's not like what they did to She-Ra in the recent Netflix reboot. With a cast as big as Princess of Power there's certainly room for some LGBT representation. The problem was they took one of the few characters, She-Ra/Adora, whose romantic backstory was very clear and completely changed it. They then turned her arch-enemy, Catra, into a sociopath and their entire relationship was abusive and toxic. The entire series was Catra abusing, using and manipulating people while trying to kill Adora and all her friends. The series ended pretty much with okay you just tried to kill us all and destroy our reality but it's now all forgiven, let's kiss. Wait, what? On top of all that, Adora and Catra had been raised as siblings by Shadow Weaver in the new series.

I hope Robin story line is handled better than that.

[PNGwynne]

First of all, thank you for this thread, for the thoughtful OP and ensuing discussion. I'm pleased, if for nothing else, that it isn't a Bobby Drake "OMG The world is ending, my childhood is destroyed." bash. And Burt Ward,...yeah :-) . I recall when an appreciation of him almost burned down the museum.

That said, I've mixed feelings on this. I haven't read Batman comics in 15 years but I read much of the original run of Tim Drake's Robin book. My first reaction to the news was that it feels opportunistic. But, I have to acknowledge that desire can be fluid, that comics have a smaller select readership than ever before, that younger readers are more sophisticated than I was "back then", and that comics flux rapidly now--continuity is not monolithic.

I think there is room for a Robin who is not straight, but I might not have chosen Tim. Still, I'm unaware of what Monitor describes.

Personally, as others have suggested, my preference for LGBTQ comics characters would be for unique characters--handled better than Extrano was. I would have welcomed some supportive, thoughtful representation as a younger reader. I do like Batwoman as a "new" character but with a nod to an earlier legacy character.

And DC--I recall when Denny O'Neil wanted to make the Joker more "flamboyant"--because that's "even more villainous." I'll take this attempt over that. Is the mark of a successful LGBTQ character that gender identity is not noteworthy, but instead intrinsic and integrated in fostering stories? Lots to think about.

Keep fighting the good fight, Boy Wonder.

[Dark Shadow]

As a stuffy old straight guy, I kind of scoff at what seems to be semi-random "assignments" to potentially grab headlines, because they almost always go against previously established character traits. Tim has had quite a few romances, all girls, Stephanie (Spoiler/Robin/Batgirl) Brown being the primary one. Having said all that, there are plenty of characters who match my preferences (like 90 plus % of them). I would prefer creators create their own characters and not bend existing characters to their needs, but I also understand it means more to people to have an established hero represent something you can relate to.

Chris

FWIW...You don't seem "stuffy" to me at all.

In general, I completely agree with you regarding creating new characters vs. "reimagining" established characters. We are all individuals who have our own paths to blaze. We don't need to appropriate somebody else's accomplishments and/or identity in order to become successful, much less exist. From my perspective, it cheapens and robs from both.

That said, there certainly are some "late bloomers" in the real world. If Tim's story is intended to touch upon that reality from an honest and earnest standpoint, then it could have a positive impact, however I'm skeptical that that is the motivation in this case.

I should have mentioned that Tim's obsession over Connor could have been read as romantic. I do think males can have strong feelings for each other without any kind of romantic/sexual component but that aspect of Tim's character can certainly be seen as a roadmap to where he's being taken now.

Chris

Absolutely agree here too. Most of my friendships over the years have been with straight men & women as well as other gay men, none of which have a romantic or sexual aspect to them. Hmm...maybe I'm the stuffy old straight guy

[Dark Shadow]

I grew up in the 70's were Robin were those short-shorts. I read a lot of Batman & Robin but started to collect more Robin merchandise without knowing why.

From Elementary though the 7th grade I never showed interest in girls. Where I grew up I did not know about liking guys. All I ever saw or heard about was boy-girl relations. It wasn't until I was in the 8th grade where I meet my first bestfriend & soon boyfriend. We were the only 8th graders in 1st period gym class so Coach let us fold that days towels, We were in a closet bumping into each other and one thing led to another we began kissing. We stayed together through High School. It was when he spent to night at my house that he gave me a smirk and said now he knows why I like boys, with all these Robin items its basically a boy in green underwear. We laughed and made my night when he put on my Robin Underroos.

So yes Robin does mean something to me that I will always thank DC Comics for.

I share your Robin obsession! I had tons of Robin stuff that greatly outnumbered my Batman stuff too. Thanks for sharing your story, I found it heartening. Something I always yearned for when I was that age, but did not have the strength or courage to pursue until later on.

[Dark Shadow]

First of all, thank you for this thread, for the thoughtful OP and ensuing discussion. I'm pleased, if for nothing else, that it isn't a Bobby Drake "OMG The world is ending, my childhood is destroyed." bash. And Burt Ward,...yeah :-) . I recall when an appreciation of him almost burned down the museum.

That said, I've mixed feelings on this. I haven't read Batman comics in 15 years but I read much of the original run of Tim Drake's Robin book. My first reaction to the news was that it feels opportunistic. But, I have to acknowledge that desire can be fluid, that comics have a smaller select readership than ever before, that younger readers are more sophisticated than I was "back then", and that comics flux rapidly now--continuity is not monolithic.

I think there is room for a Robin who is not straight, but I might not have chosen Tim. Still, I'm unaware of what Monitor describes.

Personally, as others have suggested, my preference for LGBTQ comics characters would be for unique characters--handled better than Extrano was. I would have welcomed some supportive, thoughtful representation as a younger reader. I do like Batwoman as a "new" character but with a nod to an earlier legacy character.

And DC--I recall when Denny O'Neil wanted to make the Joker more "flamboyant"--because that's "even more villainous." I'll take this attempt over that. Is the mark of a successful LGBTQ character that gender identity is not noteworthy, but instead intrinsic and integrated in fostering stories? Lots to think about.

Keep fighting the good fight, Boy Wonder.

Very eloquently stated! And yes, the flamboyant villains (cough, ***Disney***, cough, cough)!

[PNGwynne]

Don't get me wrong, I love scenery-chewing, flamboyant villains. But gueer-coding them to make them more "evil" is off-putting to me. That was a common trope in the '70's, from Dirty Harry onwards.