Lucas waves hand: "Greedo shot first from the beginning..."

[mego73]

George Lucas infers it was sloppy editing that made it seem Han shot first in 1977

5 Questions With George Lucas: Controversial - Hollywood Reporter (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/george-lucas-star-wars-interview-288523)

[Brue]

That is nice George. Why is it that in NO versions of the script (including scripts that include deleted scenes) does greedo get a shot off. I have several versins of hte script and this just isn't true. AND

IF it was just due to sloppy editing, it makes the character more appealing anyway. He had a journey to travel from mercenary to hero. If he was a hero to start with, he went nowhere. No character growth is not a good character.

[Nostalgiabuff]

either way, Greedo had a gun on him and was getting ready to shoot, so Han shooting first is not cold blooded murder, it is self defense

[SeattleEd]

I call shenanigans on Lucas. Of course it's his script and world so he is god and can do whatever he wants. LOL

[Random Axe]

I'm pretty certain it wasn't in the novelization that way either. Lucas is full of it. If he were to ever be given an enema, he could fit inside a shoebox.

[Brazoo]

He does this with a lot of his memories.

And yeah - shooting a guy who's training a gun on you and says they're going to kill you - is self defense, not murder.

[Brazoo]

It really is amazing how much he revises events in his mind. Between his personal stuff, his muddling with his movies (and even their titles), and the odd claims he makes, like 'Star Wars had a small budget for the time' (it didn't), I'm always amazed.

To be fair to him - I think he clearly has some bad associations to that period of time looking back on his life.

[Brue]

Do you remember the sequel to ET or all the rereleases of Close Encounters? How about the revisions to Schindler's List? No? Right.

[jwyblejr]

And then he wonders why fans get miffed at him.

[samurainoir]

It really is amazing how much he revises events in his mind. Between his personal stuff, his muddling with his movies (and even their titles), and the odd claims he makes, like 'Star Wars had a small budget for the time' (it didn't), I'm always amazed.

To be fair to him - I think he clearly has some bad associations to that period of time looking back on his life.

Wasn't his ex-wife the one who edited Star Wars originally?

[Brazoo]

Wasn't his ex-wife the one who edited Star Wars originally?

Exactly - she worked on the original 3 movies. By all accounts she was an editor with a great story sense, and from various sources she was one of the few collaborators Lucas had who could criticize him and have it effect his decisions. She also edited for Frances Ford Coppola and Scorsese.

By all accounts George is a great editor too - but he is often criticized for not understanding the emotional structure or characters the same way - and it seems like she brought that to his projects.

In the book Skywalking (which I read years ago), they talk at length about her contributions - which are never acknowledged now. She has been credited for rearranging the original climax of Star Wars to make it work.

Off-hand there's another story I always remember - Spielberg and Lucas screened "Raiders of the Lost Ark" for feedback - the movie originally went from Indy with the G-Men arguing about the ark directly to the big warehouse shot with the dude pushing the ark in a crate - everyone else was flipping out about how great the movie was, and Marcia caught everyone off-guard by asking 'what happened to Marion?' Everyone forgot about tying that loose end up - They had to go back and reshot the scene in the film now.

It's the kind of thing she's credited for - not being shy about her opinions and contributing valuable insight.

You'll never hear her name on a Star Wars commentary though.

[Goblin19]

That's interesting. I had never heard that before.

[Mawni]

He just likes to mess with the fans.

[kennermike]

I dont know what to say about Lucas anymore:please_y:? Im out !:yeah::yeah:

[Brazoo]

For more on Marcia Lucas, check out the book "Skywalking: The Life and Films Of George Lucas", which I believe was written with Lucas' cooperation, and then not authorized by him.

There's a summary of that book and other insights into Marcia Lucas here:
The Secret History of Star Wars (http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com/marcialucas.html)

There's some gossipy stuff mixed in there too, but I have to say, I don't think his work has been as good without her - so I do think that lends credence to her being a key to his success to some degree. Also, he really does seem fixated on re-writing his own history.


Here's some insight into her influence:


"After THX went down the toilet, I never said, 'I told you so,' but I reminded George that I warned him it hadn't involved the audience emotionally...He always said, 'Emotionally involving the audience is easy. Anybody can do it blindfolded, get a little kitten and have some guy wring its neck.' All he wanted to do was abstract filmmaking, tone poems, collections of images. So finally, George said to me, 'I'm gonna show you how easy it is. I'll make a film that emotionally involves the audience."

[kennermike]

For more on Marcia Lucas, check out the book "Skywalking: The Life and Films Of George Lucas", which I believe was written with Lucas' cooperation, and then not authorized by him.

There's a summary of that book and other insights into Marcia Lucas here:
The Secret History of Star Wars (http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com/marcialucas.html)

There's some gossipy stuff mixed in there too, but I have to say, I don't think his work has been as good without her - so I do think that lends credence to her being a key to his success to some degree. Also, he really does seem fixated on re-writing his own history.


Here's some insight into her influence:

I totally forgot about the contribution Marcia Lucas brought to the project

[Werewolf]

For more on Marcia Lucas, check out the book "Skywalking: The Life and Films Of George Lucas", which I believe was written with Lucas' cooperation, and then not authorized by him.

There's a summary of that book and other insights into Marcia Lucas here:
The Secret History of Star Wars (http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com/marcialucas.html)


Thanks for the link. Informative read. Makes a lot of sense in context on how his movies have gotten worse. Jedi is definitely weakest of the original trilogy and the film he had the greatest control over. The new movies just suck. No emotional spark. You don't care about the characters and the "romance" between Padme and Anakin was just cringe worthy.

I knew he was a self important thin skinned BSer that liked to rewrite his own history but to try to erase a person's existance and accomplishments is more cruel, petty and vindictive than I would have given him credit for.

[johnmiic]

Maybe Marcia Lucas should be hired to do Special Editions on the prequels.

[samurainoir]

I haven't reread Skywalking since the nineties, but it was definitey a must read for Star Wars fans.

Given his closely he skated to risk and ruin throughout the first half of his life as a filmmaker, I think it gave hs films a real sense of urgency and energy that the new films really seem to lack. just as there were ridiculous stakes in those original films, these were really real stakes for Lucas who was always convinced that he was going to crash and burn. What's really telling is the part of the book which details the production of Empire, and how he beleived Kirscher was ruining his film, and managed to return to micromanaging on Jedi.

Also worth reading alongside this book is the biography Lucas' mentor, Francs Frord Coppola. Given their close relationship in the beginning, I think it really helps to see what Coppoa went through during those times... Particularly since Coppola did actually fall off that cliff that Lucas always feared, both creatively and commercially. And more than once!
Amazon.com: Whom God Wishes to Destroy . . .: Francis Coppola and the New Hollywood (9780822318897): Jon Lewis: Books (http://www.amazon.com/Whom-God-Wishes-Destroy-Hollywood/dp/082231889X)
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51090Q37EQL._SL500_AA300_.jpg

And if you want to follow the lineage, there is the biography of Coppoa's mentor, Roger Corman.
Amazon.com: Roger Corman: An Unauthorized Biography of the Godfather of Indie Filmmaking (9781580631464): Beverly Gray: Books (http://www.amazon.com/Roger-Corman-Unauthorized-Biography-Filmmaking/dp/1580631460)
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41DWYMBNC2L._SL500_AA300_.jpg

[Bruce Banner]

"Skywalking" is definitely a great book.

And yeah, that "The Secret History of Star Wars" is also very interesting and informative. The PDF version I read a few years ago was full of terrible grammar which actually made the thing a chore to read, but I hear it's been tidied up and proofread since then.

John Baxter's biography of Lucas is also worth reading:

http://img.dooyoo.co.uk/GB_EN/orig/0/1/4/2/4/142444.jpg

[Brazoo]

I haven't reread Skywalking since the nineties, but it was definitey a must read for Star Wars fans.

Given his closely he skated to risk and ruin throughout the first half of his life as a filmmaker, I think it gave hs films a real sense of urgency and energy that the new films really seem to lack. just as there were ridiculous stakes in those original films, these were really real stakes for Lucas who was always convinced that he was going to crash and burn. What's really telling is the part of the book which details the production of Empire, and how he beleived Kirscher was ruining his film, and managed to return to micromanaging on Jedi.

Also worth reading alongside this book is the biography Lucas' mentor, Francs Frord Coppola. Given their close relationship in the beginning, I think it really helps to see what Coppoa went through during those times... Particularly since Coppola did actually fall off that cliff that Lucas always feared, both creatively and commercially. And more than once!
Amazon.com: Whom God Wishes to Destroy . . .: Francis Coppola and the New Hollywood (9780822318897): Jon Lewis: Books (http://www.amazon.com/Whom-God-Wishes-Destroy-Hollywood/dp/082231889X)
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51090Q37EQL._SL500_AA300_.jpg


Too funny - I was actually going to come back and add that there was a doc called "A Legacy of Filmmakers: The Early Years of American Zoetrope" that people should check out. Interviews with Coppola and others (including Lucas) recounting young Lucas as a filmmaker and Coppola's dream of creating American Zoetrope with Lucas (and how "TX 1138" kinda brought it down).

You'll see TONS of parallels between Coppola's dream of American Zoetrope and what Lucas ended up creating with Skywalker Ranch.

Playing amateur psychologist I think a major problem was that Lucas stopped working with or listening to anyone critical after Irving Kirshner and Marcia Lucas.

For example, people at ILM were concerned about Jar Jar Binks, but Lucas dismissed that criticism. Later, when fans complained about the character, he turned the criticism back on the fans saying things like: "(Fans) want the films to be tough like The Terminator, and they get very upset and opinionated about anything that has anything to do with being childlike." not understanding (or not admitting) that just because something might be "childlike" doesn't automatically make it good.

It's the same thing here with this Greedo thing - Lucas deals with criticism by just flipping everything back on the critic - despite logic or facts. I think there's a exposed nerve there based on his history.

[Gorn Captain]

In about another 20 years, and a couple of more Special Editions, they won't be shooting at each other at all: Han will gently tell Greedo to go home and rethink his life. That guns are bad and that we should all get along, and that not even harsh language is warranted. It will no longer be called Star Wars but...ahum..Star Trek...:grin:

I'm still hoping for a version that has Greedo beat the **** out of Ford for marrying Callista Flockheart and getting his ear pierced...

[Figuremod73]

He thought Kirscher was ruining The Empire Strikes Back? What??? Lucas should have let him handle Jedi, IMO. Have to admit I dont understand him sometimes either...

There was bounty hunters after Han, could you blame him for being a little trigger happy?

[ctc]

>In about another 20 years, and a couple of more Special Editions, they won't be shooting at each other at all

From points 8 - 6:

The 10 Best Sci-Fi Films Never Made | Cracked.com (http://www.cracked.com/article_15631_the-10-best-sci-fi-films-never-made_p2.html?wa_user1=4&wa_user2=Movies+%26+TV&wa_user3=article&wa_user4=flashback)

....notably:

>Here's something unpleasant: All art comes from demons. Not real demons, in most cases, but demons of angst and horrible memories and sexual frustration. You get beat up in school because, while the cool kids are putting bruises on each other on the football field, you were sitting on the steps writing your science-fiction stories. That fear and tension that winds itself around your soul like steel wire as you try nervously to sneak out of the locker room before the big kids give you a Wedgie and a Tittie-Twister and a Dirty Sanchez, all that builds up into adulthood. Art is how you let it out.

>It was an angsty ******* who introduced Han Solo to the world by showing him ruthlessly blowing the face off a mafia bill collector, shooting him from under the table and then cooly walking away and paying his tab. Lucas introduced Obi-Wan Kenobi by having him end a bar fight by slicing a guy's arm off.

>Lucas didn't flinch at the thought of blowing up the peaceful planet of Alderaan and killing billions. None of this was gratuitous; it told us the story and what the stakes were.

>Angst drives it. Now, if the artist is lucky, that angst goes away. If the audience is lucky, it doesn't. The art dies with the angst, you see. By middle age the artist finds himself watching his old films and trying to make ones that sort of look the same, or trying to make films his children can watch. It gets bland.

Don C.

[Gorn Captain]

I'm reading The Making of The Empire Strikes Back, which is very candid about all the arguments during the production.
During meetings with Lucas and the pre-production crew (writer, director, producer, etc), the person who took notes of that meeting only wrote down "what George said".