Leeping Lizards!

[AJ Collector]

How nice is this.......


PALITOY MEGO WGSH SPIDER-MAN LIZARD MOC RARE ONLY ONE!! - eBay (item 260438097654 end time Jul-09-09 13:00:00 PDT) (http://cgi.ebay.com/PALITOY-MEGO-WGSH-SPIDER-MAN-LIZARD-MOC-RARE-ONLY-ONE_W0QQitemZ260438097654QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Toy sGames_ActionFigures_ActionFigures_JN?hash=item3ca 351fef6&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C39%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294 %3A50)

[pmwasson]

That is a beauty! Wonder how high it will get?

[pmwasson]

Hey, I think its the same one pictured in the Museum. Notice the little ding on the lower right edge of the card. I guess he wasn't kidding when he said its the only known example.

[SUP-Ronin]

Oh man, I want one of those. Already outta my league. Dang.

[toys2cool]

yup that's beautiful :drool:

[starsky]

i'm sure there's going to be a bidding war on this piece!

[vulcan2074]

I Love the Palitoy WGSH MOC. Damn there Hott :beaming1:
Sammy

[NewForce]

here is another perfect example of why you don;t put in a high bid first...
now, bidders identities are "private" but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the high bidder was shilled up quite a bit (or fished up, take your pick)...
from my observation, the high bidder at 500 placed that bid when the current high bidder was at 277...
then, it appears (based on the time index) that one bidder either "fished" or shilled the bid all the way up to the high bidders max (incrementally, a 495 pound bid would have made the high bidder 502 if they had a higher proxy...so, the fact that it stopped at 500, tells me that is their high bid...and, strangely enough, the fisher/shiller, should know this too, yet somehow conveniently stopped bidding, when high bid is in their reach...)....
private listing - bidders' identities protected GBP 500.00 Jun-29-09 18:52:53 PDT
private listing - bidders' identities protected GBP 495.00 Jun-29-09 20:46:14 PDT
private listing - bidders' identities protected GBP 475.00 Jun-29-09 20:46:02 PDT
private listing - bidders' identities protected GBP 442.00 Jun-29-09 20:45:41 PDT
private listing - bidders' identities protected GBP 422.00 Jun-29-09 20:45:10 PDT
private listing - bidders' identities protected GBP 402.00 Jun-29-09 20:44:42 PDT
private listing - bidders' identities protected GBP 325.00 Jun-29-09 20:44:05 PDT
private listing - bidders' identities protected GBP 300.00 Jun-29-09 20:43:51 PDT
private listing - bidders' identities protected GBP 277.00 Jun-29-09 19:44:26 PDT

[dumbldor]

I can assure you there is no shilling going on with this seller.

[LonnieFisher]

Maybe they had to stop bidding because somebody ditched their high bid on something else and got screwed on another auction? It was probably a real bidder who was just trying to find out how much the other high bid was to see if they even can compete. It is possible that bidder two will be bidder one at the end of the auction. Unless bidder one bids again he will probably lose it at the end of the sale. Why do people think it is wrong to be a "fisher" but not a "sniper"? Then again it might just sell for the price it is now. Or maybe somebody will cancel his bids and the auction will sell for less than it is now. Or maybe the guy will shut the auction down and not sell it because it isn't selling for enough.

[LonnieFisher]

I can assure you there is no shilling going on with this seller.

Are you bidder two? Just curious...:wink:

[Surfsup]

Sellers identities are private so they don't get any hassles from any other people after winning the item, no other reason aside from that. As for shilling; it's something that I have never done or would ever consider (thanks for the post Dan).

[NewForce]

I can assure you there is no shilling going on with this seller.

shill bidding does not always have to originate with the seller...could be anyone bidding up , incrementally, without intention to take high bid... again, it could also be, and is more likely just fishing, but the bidding history is "suspect" to some degree, already, IMO

that was my only point

[NewForce]

Sellers identities are private so they don't get any hassles from any other people after winning the item, no other reason aside from that. As for shilling; it's something that I have never done or would ever consider (thanks for the post Dan). I still don't get the reasoning for private bidding... bidders id's are masked these days anyway, right? so no one knows who wins anyway... but, at least without private bidding, one can get a better grasp on what type of bidder is participating in an auction...

that said, at 500 pounds, I suspect, that price is far from where this auction will end, but there is definitely (again, IMO) some interesting bidding patterns already...

and, I can also say that if surfsup is vilhelm34 from ebay (I am just making that connection based on responses), then I can attest to the fact that we have had a very smooth transaction in the recent past, and I won't hesitate to bid on his auctions... but, that doesn't change the fact that these days, I tend to question everything that doesn't have transparency...it is nothing personal, I have just seen too many "strange" things of late...

[NewForce]

Maybe they had to stop bidding because somebody ditched their high bid on something else and got screwed on another auction? It was probably a real bidder who was just trying to find out how much the other high bid was to see if they even can compete. It is possible that bidder two will be bidder one at the end of the auction. Unless bidder one bids again he will probably lose it at the end of the sale. Why do people think it is wrong to be a "fisher" but not a "sniper"? Then again it might just sell for the price it is now. Or maybe somebody will cancel his bids and the auction will sell for less than it is now. Or maybe the guy will shut the auction down and not sell it because it isn't selling for enough.

I agree with you...could be any or all of the above...I guess I was just using it as an illustration for "general" about how one should not lay all their cards on the table in the beginning... there is nothing wrong with being a fishing bidder (as you state, it can reveal the high bidders current proxy, and, as you say, if the high bidder doesn't bid again, can let the fisher know that next bid wins it.... but, when the fisher never makes another bid, that should raise questions, right? and I don't mean specific to this auction, because this one is far from over, but in general?)

and, at 500 pounds, that is probably quite a distance from the ending price, so I don't think the bidding history up to date is anthing other than "opening" type bids ... in fact ,as the 500 pound bid placer, I can state with certainty it is just a placement bid...

that said, it is nice to know the seller is a member (I think I am correct, right? from Dan's post)

[dumbldor]

Are you bidder two? Just curious...:wink:

No, not me.

I know the seller would never do that. He is a good personal friend. I know him well and know he would never shill his auctions.

Rick, a 'shill' on this message board is a very negative term that is an accusation that either the seller or a good buddy is bidding up the auction. There is really no ambiguity as far as I have ever known.

[dumbldor]

One more thing, I can certainly understand keeping bidders' identities private when the item could easily go for 5 figures. There are a lot of people out there who do not want everybody to know that they are spending that kind of money or acquiring a one of a kind item. I think that's a good strategy, Bill.

Even though ebay scrambles bidder IDs, there are ways to figure out who is who if you track sales long enough.

[NewForce]

No, not me.

I know the seller would never do that. He is a good personal friend. I know him well and know he would never shill his auctions.

Rick, a 'shill' on this message board is a very negative term that is an accusation that either the seller or a good buddy is bidding up the auction. There is really no ambiguity as far as I have ever known.
maybe, as I emailed you Dan, I am misusing the term "shill" ..it wouldn't be the first time I have done that...the majority of my bidding occurs in comic book auctions, and the term "shill" is used to deisignate "any" bidding that is done (by a seller/house, by a good friend, by a total stranger) to raise the price of an auction, without the appearance of the intent to win... now, I agree, that is not positive, but it is also not meant to be a negative attack, especially on this specific auction/seller, just an observation!

... naturally, my intention is never to acuse or imply anything that I cannot prove... my intention with the term use was to alert folks (as I have pm'd with Lonnie) the hazards of bidding to high, to early...

someone else emailed me that "punishment" bid is a better term... that sounds good too, but that would imply more that someone knows a high bidders max, and then bids them upto that point just to "punish" them for some reason...but, i am good with whatever term the general masses like...

just wanted to make sure that folks know I am not accusing anyone of anything...

[NewForce]

One more thing, I can certainly understand keeping bidders' identities private when the item could easily go for 5 figures. There are a lot of people out there who do not want everybody to know that they are spending that kind of money or acquiring a one of a kind item. I think that's a good strategy, Bill.

Even though ebay scrambles bidder IDs, there are ways to figure out who is who if you track sales long enough. I can see that point of view, and major comic book auction houses employ the same bidding strategy...

but, and ebay is far from perfect, the one thing I used to like about ebay, versus an auction house, is that you "could" see who you were bidding against... I think we have all questioned, at some time in the past, the bidding patterns of a noob or low/zero feedback...but, it certainly makes me feel "better" if I win or lose to someone with a 700 or 7000 feedback... to me, it just ads transparency and more legitimacy to an auction...I would assume I am not alone here, but if I am wrong, I can live with that too...

and, I also would say, that if someone really wanted to find out the winner, they could, without having to follow bidding histories (that is a lot of work, and still might be unlikely you could ever figure it out)... in Florida, if I particiapate in any public auction, and I lose, I have the right (Legally) to know who the winner is (now in Texas, you don't, as an example)...like moving a mountain to get ebay to release that info, but with proper "motivation", they will... so, in GENERAL, I don't buy that explaination...

another thing to consider, is that , in general, the players or bidders in an auction of this potential magnitude, are generally "known" within the community... perfect example is Dan... my gut tells me he probably knows most all the high end mego players, like I know most all the high end Comic book players... given enough years in the hobby, you tend to know the shakers and the bakers... so, anonymity as a bidder of such an auction, seems like a weak explaination to me, as well...after all, very few folks want to own a piece like this, and not be able to "claim" they own it (it is human nature to share, or show off, or whatever you want to call it...and, in most instances, it is fun to share with your friends and fellow collectors)... and if someone is worried about theft, etc, that is what insurance is for...

so, we will just have to agree to disagree that private auctions are good, I don't think they help at all, I believe they actually have the potential to hurt an auction, but that is just my opinion...

[LonnieFisher]

Shill bidding only help the seller, ebay, and paypal. Seller gets more. Ebay gets more. Paypal gets more. Too bad for the sucker that is the buyer. Stupid enough to bid on ebay. Buyers deserve to get ripped off.
This is what hiding the bidders identification says to me. It says "We, as ebay/paypal want all the cash possible. We don't care if buyers get ripped off as long as they don't know they are getting ripped off and we can profit from their idiocy."

[clemso]

I'll vouch for Surfsup, He is what Vinny was to Kresge, the true PalitoyKid (Sorry Brian) Bill is a top bloke for sure.

[palitoy]

the true PalitoyKid (Sorry Brian) Bill is a top bloke for sure.

No need to apologize, I was never a player, Bill is however and he's a great guy on top of it.

I chose this screen name because of my love for the Space:1999 line anyway ;)

[LovetheLizard]

I would say congrats to the new owner, but since I lost my holy grail I am a tad sour at the moment.

Oh well I suppose it wasn't meant to be...

:cry:

Aaron

[clemso]

$2.5K doesn't seem like much for a carded example of this rarity.

[dumbldor]

Oh, man, I am sorry for the seller to see it went this low. :ugh_y:

[NewForce]

Oh, man, I am sorry for the seller to see it went this low. :ugh_y: well, I had a 2174 pound snipe entered with 10 seconds, clicked on bid and confirm bid and apparently it took too long?, as my bid didn't execute ....not saying that would have won, but I figured $3500 for the fig was a good price, even with it being resealed, if I got lucky and won... pretty sure there is no recourse, unless the winner doesn't pay, then the seller can sell to me for what I would have bid or somewhere between that and the winning bid?

[LovetheLizard]

well, I had a 2174 pound snipe entered with 10 seconds, clicked on bid and confirm bid and apparently it took too long?, as my bid didn't execute ....not saying that would have won, but I figured $3500 for the fig was a good price, even with it being resealed, if I got lucky and won... pretty sure there is no recourse, unless the winner doesn't pay, then the seller can sell to me for what I would have bid or somewhere between that and the winning bid?

I would trump your bid. This is the only Lizard variation I need to complete my collection. The only reason I lost this is because I was at work and forgot to bid because I was "bothered" and was not able to confirm my final bid.

Darn, perhaps another day. Now here's hoping the buyer sells one day.

[LonnieFisher]

This is the only Lizard variation I need to complete my collection.
I have a Mego Lizard you don't have...

[clemso]

I have a Mego Lizard you don't have...

Lonnie, why don't you post a pic. I would love to see it.

Clem

[LonnieFisher]

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i150/Lonniefisher/flesh%20body%20mego%20Lizard/6a1e200a.jpg
Let's see if the pic works.
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i150/Lonniefisher/flesh%20body%20mego%20Lizard/3f50678d.jpg
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i150/Lonniefisher/flesh%20body%20mego%20Lizard/megofleshbodyLizard008.jpg

[LonnieFisher]

This is not your average Lizard. Close examination of the joints and rivets shows that they have not been altered. And I think the ink on the head between the scales was done by somebody at Mego. I theorize that this is the first Lizard to be assembled to show the home office that the legs and arms fit the old upper legs and upper arms. The ink on the head was most likely to see if it should get detailed in production. It is pretty much just on the left half of head. I'll probably take it to Megomeet2010 to show off upstairs in the museum. Any other theories on the creation of this particular figure?

[LovetheLizard]

Lonnie,

I have seen photos of your loose flesh Lizard before. It is a cool piece, but unfortunately I would not be interested even if you would sell. I am by nature a packaged toy collector and unless we are talking prototypes I will not buy a loose figure. I just think it is something special to own a figure in it's original package.

This Palitoy Lizard is upsetting to me because it is my grail piece and it came up at the worst possible time in my life. I can assure you there aren't a lot of people out there that adore this charcter as much as I do.

I just hope the new owner loves the character and did not just purchase for an investment.

Had this come up a few years ago I would have paid 3 times as much as it ended up selling for.

Aaron

[LonnieFisher]

This would be a prototype. A factory prototype. It is probably the only one that got the flesh parts and the hand drawn scale detail. It is just the point that it's a variation you don't have. As far as being loose, dressed and dropped in the misprinted box I have and he is prototype in mint 1st style box. He is loose and naked to show off his awesomeness. It is unique unto itself and is the only one ever to surface in the collecting community. If only I could have gotten the one of a kind package to reseal him in. That would have been cool. I had my figure dressed and in a box, but it just didn't seem right to hide his nakedness. He is a nudist by nature. Lizards hate to wear clothes. And harnesses. My nile monitor hates harnesses. And people.
One-of-a-kind Mego Lizard... that's all I can say really.

[D!n0-M@n]

This would be a prototype. A factory prototype. It is probably the only one that got the flesh parts and the hand drawn scale detail. It is just the point that it's a variation you don't have. As far as being loose, dressed and dropped in the misprinted box I have and he is prototype in mint 1st style box. He is loose and naked to show off his awesomeness. It is unique unto itself and is the only one ever to surface in the collecting community. If only I could have gotten the one of a kind package to reseal him in. That would have been cool. I had my figure dressed and in a box, but it just didn't seem right to hide his nakedness. He is a nudist by nature. Lizards hate to wear clothes. And harnesses. My nile monitor hates harnesses. And people.
One-of-a-kind Mego Lizard... that's all I can say really.

And man it is AWESOME! :grin:

[LovetheLizard]

This would be a prototype. A factory prototype. It is probably the only one that got the flesh parts and the hand drawn scale detail. It is just the point that it's a variation you don't have. As far as being loose, dressed and dropped in the misprinted box I have and he is prototype in mint 1st style box. He is loose and naked to show off his awesomeness. It is unique unto itself and is the only one ever to surface in the collecting community. If only I could have gotten the one of a kind package to reseal him in. That would have been cool. I had my figure dressed and in a box, but it just didn't seem right to hide his nakedness. He is a nudist by nature. Lizards hate to wear clothes. And harnesses. My nile monitor hates harnesses. And people.
One-of-a-kind Mego Lizard... that's all I can say really.

Lonnie,

Not trying to be conterversial, but I own some "newer" (90's) toybiz "true" prototypes and know where they originated from and they are definitely different (i.e. resin figure not plastic and have metal "peg" joints instead of plastic) than production run. How do you know that this piece isn't just a factory error? Knowing what we know about the low cost production of many mego figures this could very easily be just a situation where they used a flesh body for the figure and the head was either a factoy defect or some child colored in the lines.

Again, just pointing out that you want to be very careful when using the term prototype unless you definitely know or have substantiating proof that it is indeed a true first mold / prototype.

Has anyone ever spoken to individuals within the MEGO research & development department to clarify an actual MEGO prototype?


Aaron

[LonnieFisher]

Not trying to be conterversial, but I own some "newer" (90's) toybiz "true" prototypes and know where they originated from and they are definitely different (i.e. resin figure not plastic and have metal "peg" joints instead of plastic) than production run. How do you know that this piece isn't just a factory error? Knowing what we know about the low cost production of many mego figures this could very easily be just a situation where they used a flesh body for the figure and the head was either a factoy defect or some child colored in the lines.
Aaron
Do you have prototype bodies or figures? This is not a prototype body, hence the factory produced common parts.
My opinion from here out. I have worked in plastic injection factories making ammo parts and medical parts. So I have some knowledge of the industry)
This would be prototype Lizard. Factory produced figures have more of a run than 1. There are no others out there that anybody knows about. This would be the one put together to see if the newly produced pieces fit the older body parts. Maybe they even did a few. They obviously wouldn't all survive. Or even get into the hands of the public. If they had green bodies when the legs and arms were made they would have put it together with an all green body. This probably predates the production figures by at least a month. Put it together and then ship it to the U.S. to get approval. Things were slower back then.
Do you think all the bodies are assembled individually? Not how it works in a factory. For this to be a production piece there will have to be more out there. I have had this figure for a lot of years and not one other has surfaced to challenge it's uniqueness.
If somebody has one, I would love to see pictures!